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Re: I feel good
gardenchat@hort.net

There is one at the University and one done by the City of Riverside as
a model for good looking landscaping with lower water needs.


ETN Zone 7 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Cyndi D Civ USAF AFMC 95 CS/SCOSI Johnson" <cyndi.johnson@edwards.af.mil> 
To: gardenchat@hort.net 
Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 10:48:42 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: RE: [CHAT] I feel good 

Riverside? Is it at University of CA Riverside? I haven't been to that 
one but I'm not aware of any other so I'd be interested to know the 
name. There's one near San Diego I'd like to visit too. 
We used to own a rental house where the caliche layer was about 18" down 
in one corner of the property. We were attempting to put in a fence 
around the backyard. What a PITA! We had a powered auger to dig the 
postholes but it was hand-held. The two of us had that thing on max 
power with our full weight on it, but finally gave up on the last two 
holes, it's just like cutting through rock. I don't remember what we 
ended up doing to secure the posts. 

Cyndi 


-----Original Message----- 
From: owner-gardenchat@hort.net [mailto:owner-gardenchat@hort.net] On 
Behalf Of BONNIE_HOLMES 
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2010 4:18 PM 
To: gardenchat@hort.net 
Subject: Re: [CHAT] I feel good 

No, the hard clay isn't as bad as caliche, which we also have in this 
area but I don't have it. It is almost impossible to get that soil 
improved even though we have lots of moisture . Around here we use that 
type of soil for pond liners. I have visited some native gardens in your 
area, definitely arid. But, occasionally you can see beautiful gardens 
made of native plants. Riverside has a nice one. 


ETN Zone 7 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Cyndi D Civ USAF AFMC 95 CS/SCOSI Johnson" 
<cyndi.johnson@edwards.af.mil> 
To: gardenchat@hort.net 
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2010 6:44:17 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: RE: [CHAT] I feel good 

They call that layer "caliche" here. It's common in the desert, but if 
we have it, it's pretty far down, we've had to dig some trenches for 
electrical and plumbing and haven't run into it. 
I'm in the Antelope Valley in southern California - high desert. It's 
dry. 

Cyndi 


-----Original Message----- 
From: owner-gardenchat@hort.net [mailto:owner-gardenchat@hort.net] On 
Behalf Of BONNIE_HOLMES 
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2010 3:06 PM 
To: gardenchat@hort.net 
Subject: Re: [CHAT] I feel good 

Could it be that you have strips of hardpan underneath? My soil greatly 
varies. In some spots, it is pretty good, others a light clay and ok, 
and in a few spots hard clay. When I prepared beds in the hard clay, I 
would dig down as deep as the shovel and bury kitchen mulch. In a year, 
the soil would be pretty good. Where are you? 


ETN Zone 7 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Cyndi D Civ USAF AFMC 95 CS/SCOSI Johnson" 
<cyndi.johnson@edwards.af.mil> 
To: gardenchat@hort.net 
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2010 5:01:49 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: RE: [CHAT] I feel good 

Hmmm all good points. I didn't rototill last year at all and I don't 
remember doing much the year before that either. I wish I had seen more 
of a gradation between the mulch level and the soil, it just didn't look 


like much of the mulch was migrating downward. Things just do not rot 
here without mega-gallons of water. If I put cardboard on the ground 
right now with grass clippings on top, and we got our normal expected 
rainfall, next summer I would see a layer of mostly withered grass with 
perfectly usable cardboard underneath it. 
On the plus side since all that veg garden mulch is sopping wet now, it 
may actually start to break down. Woohoo! 
Maybe I'll just bury the irrigation farther down this summer. That would 


get water down past the mulch into the root zone and avoid stirring up 
weed seeds. Although the wind we get during the year does a really good 
job of spreading stuff around so it's not like there will be any 
shortage of weeds anyway. 
Oh well every place has its challenges. 

Cyndi 


-----Original Message----- 
From: owner-gardenchat@hort.net [mailto:owner-gardenchat@hort.net] On 
Behalf Of BONNIE_HOLMES 
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2010 12:30 PM 
To: gardenchat@hort.net 
Subject: Re: [CHAT] I feel good 

Not only do you do that but you also expose lots of buried weed seed to 
light which makes weeding much more difficult. The last class I attended 


recommended that you cut off the plants at the point where no growth can 


occur and allow the remaining with roots become part of the soil. I use 
newspaper, straw and have even used cardboard. It is great to keep down 
winter opportunist weed when you have large pieces of it. By spring it 
has disintegrated. 


ETN Zone 7 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tricia" <pdickson@sbcglobal.net> 
To: gardenchat@hort.net 
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2010 3:15:54 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern 
Subject: Re: [CHAT] I feel good 

Cyndi, 
I am not big on rototilling because of a talk I heard once by a soil 
conservationist. He talked about how if you rototill or plow to the same 



depth all the time you make a hard pan that the moisture and roots can 
not 
penetrate. I am a big mulcher with newspapers and straw or grass 
clippings 
is my favorite. The worms come and work the soil for you. 
Just my 2 cents! 
Tricia 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Johnson, Cyndi D Civ USAF AFMC 95 CS/SCOSI" 
<cyndi.johnson@edwards.af.mil> 
To: <gardenchat@hort.net> 
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2010 10:00 AM 
Subject: RE: [CHAT] I feel good 


> The friend I go hiking with was in a car accident Saturday after she 
hit 
> some black ice on a canyon road. Fractured a vertebrae, not good. So 
my 
> weekend wasn't as happy as it could have been, but I did enjoy 
grubbing 
> in the dirt both days. It was a great weekend weatherwise. No wind 
plus 
> sunshine, t-shirt weather! I worked outside clearing what was left of 
> old tomato and basil plants in the vegetable garden and cutting back 
> rabbitbrush in the dry garden. Husband dug up some old non-productive 
> grapevines, they were some kind of wine grape, and we bought new 
> Thompson Seedless and Flame to replace them. I looked for bare-root 
> fruit trees but the local selection was pathetic. We've been checking 
> since New Year's but I guess the home centers just don't get enough 
> demand for them. I did buy a Tilton apricot and I'll call the only 
real 
> nursery in town today to see if they have anything. Otherwise I'll 
have 
> to mail-order a pomegranate, a couple peach trees, and maybe a pear. 
> I pruned my dwarf nectarine and some rosebushes too, but being as I 
was 
> too lazy to go get my gloves I am all scabbed up, you'd think I'd 
learn. 
> 
> While digging in the veg garden I was noticing the soil. I have been 
> dumping spoiled hay and sheep manure in there for years. We received 
> about 4" of rain over the last few days. I dug down about 18" and the 
> top few inches, all mulch, is sopping wet. The rest of the soil is 
dry. 
> Not summer dry but not real moist either. In the "unimproved" areas 
like 
> where I planted the fruit tree, the water penetrated way down, farther 



> than I could dig. Hmmm, I'm thinking more rototilling is in my future. 



> 
> Cyndi 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: owner-gardenchat@hort.net [mailto:owner-gardenchat@hort.net] On 
> Behalf Of Kitty 
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 12:59 PM 
> To: gardenchat@hort.net 
> Subject: [CHAT] I feel good 
> 
> Fifty two lovely degrees today and the sun even came out for a few 
> minutes. 
> I washed the car, checked on some plants, generally puttered around 
> outside 
> in just a sweatshirt. Feels good to get outside. 
> High tomorrow will be 33 
> 
> Kitty 
> neIN, Zone 5 
> 
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  • References:
    • RE: I feel good
      • From: "Johnson, Cyndi D Civ USAF AFMC 95 CS/SCOSI" <cyndi.johnson@edwards.af.mil>

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