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Re: hybrids


Kitty,

Well, as it is, this car isn't cheap.  The base model Prius (no options)
sells for about $22K MSRP.  The options package that I want (Nav & backup
camera, but NOT leather seats - I have dogs), adds nearly $6k to that price,
so I am already going to be paying alot for the car.

The author of the editorial is saying that the price is "subsidized," I
presume, because there are various federal/state tax credits and/or
deductions available for consumers who purchase these vehicles.  Put it this
way - if I wasn't getting a tax credit, I'd still be buying the car because
I love it so much.  It is truly a cool, futuristic car.

My reasons for getting a Prius really are (1) concern for the environment -
it is a clean car; (2) concern about our dependence on foreign oil, and
minimizing this country's high consumption of petroleum products; (3)
supporting hybrid/alternative fuels technology; (4) it is a proven,
dependable car; and (5) it's just so freaking cool.

Eva

On 7/30/06, Kitty <kmrsy@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> Eva,
> if it cost $6000 more, would you still go for it?
> I'm sure the wait has more to do with the mfgr holding back on production
> rather than demand being so high, ohterwise they'd increase production to
> sell more cars.  I think they'd hold back, if indeed they are being
> subsidized.  They're doing just enough to prove they are actually trying,
> but not enough to prove they don't need to be subsidized.
> I think I'd be interested in one down the road after I get my 300,000
> miles
> out of my Suzuki, if they come down to a price I could afford.
>
> Kitty
> neIN, Zone 5
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Eva Tompkins LaBonte" <evatesq@gmail.com>
> To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
> Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2006 3:02 PM
> Subject: Re: [CHAT] hybrids
>
>
> > What Bonnie said is 100% right on.  The Prius totally rocks.  It is THE
> > best
> > car on the market, IMHO.  Like Bonnie, I also bought it to "walk the
> > walk".
> >
> > I have no problems with power -- the car is pretty "zippy" and I have no
> > problem taking hills or speeding up real fast to get on the highway.
> (The
> > parkways in Long Island have ridiculously short entrance ramps, so you
> > have
> > to be able to haul _ss to get on the parkway without getting killed.)
> >
> > I am getting approximately 45-50 mpg right now and I am not stingy with
> > the
> > AC.  In the winter, the mileage is less, approximately 36-44 mpg.
> >
> > I am at the end of my lease of a 2003.  I have not had one single
> > mechanical
> > problem with the car.  I have also kept up with the regular maintenance
> > schedule, which is service every 7500 miles, not every 3000 miles.
> >
> > I am getting a new Prius for sure.  The new Prius (2004 and later
> > versions)
> > get even better mileage -- they say 55-60 mpg, and they are really cool
> > and
> > gadety, with Bluetooth technology for wireless cell phone use, and a
> push
> > button start, etc.  If you get the navigation system (which I will), you
> > get
> > a back up camera that comes on when you put the car in reverse so you
> can
> > see what's behind you while you're backing up.
> >
> > I don't know why they say the cars wouldn't sell.  The demand, here, is
> > such
> > that you nearly always have to wait to get a Prius.  Very few, if any,
> are
> > ever available to buy and drive off the lot.  I ordered the new Prius
> and
> > expect to have to wait two months before it comes in.  I see alot of
> > Priuses
> > on the road too.
> >
> > My two cents.  I laugh at the fools filling up their Hummers at the gas
> > station.
> >
> > Eva
> >
> > On 7/30/06, Bonnie & Bill Morgan <wmorgan972@ameritech.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> We need to hear from Eva on this too.
> >>
> >> I have had my Prius since 2000.  We too bought it to walk the
> walk.  (We
> >> were also among the first to try a rotary engine as well when they came
> >> out
> >> as a cleaner burning engine.)  Even though the engine is smaller and
> the
> >> electric motor is not terribly large, when you couple the two up for a
> >> burst
> >> of speed or sustained speed, you don't get any lag.  You just GO as
> fast
> >> and
> >> as quick as any other car on the road.  They do NOT lack power.  Anyone
> >> who
> >> has ever given one a proper test can tell you they will get up and go
> if
> >> you
> >> kick the gas pedal.  Just like every other gas powered vehicle, your
> >> mileage
> >> will go down.  I get 40-50mpg right now in mixed driving.  Now that
> isn't
> >> as
> >> good as what was initially advertised when we bought the car, but it is
> >> still a good deal better than anyone else we know is getting for their
> >> $3.00
> >> per gallon.  If I go highway all the way and fairly level road
> >> conditions,
> >> I
> >> get better mileage.  If I do in-town driving, low speeds, I also get
> >> higher
> >> mpg.  Although it pulls hills (as when we went through the mountains)
> >> without any trouble, it costs mileage to do so (though not as much as a
> >> conventionally powered car.)  It all depends on where the testing is
> done
> >> as
> >> to whether you get the same mileage.  We've had a number of
> >> conventionally
> >> powered cars that didn't get the mileage they were purported to get.
> >> Part
> >> of that is due to topography, part to climate and part to driving
> >> style.  It
> >> is no different with a hybrid.
> >>
> >> As for the market for them, nobody driving the luxury vehicles can
> really
> >> complain about the pricing.  It is more difficult for lower income
> folks
> >> to
> >> get into one for certain, but the market IS there or there wouldn't be
> so
> >> many hybrids on back order.  My Prius is guaranteed 100,000 miles on
> the
> >> power train and many competitive gas powered vehicles don't do
> that.  And
> >> I
> >> know a lot of conventionally powered vehicles that haven't made it to
> >> 100,000 miles, period.  The story is still out on how long you can keep
> >> one
> >> running.  We are just nearing 80,000.00 but we are not seeing any
> >> problems
> >> other than the occasional burned out light bulb.
> >>
> >> If there were any way DH and I could afford another hybrid today, we
> >> would
> >> purchase it in a heart beat!  It is quiet.  It is CLEAN/GREEN with
> >> emissions
> >> so low, the locals don't even test for them anymore on a Prius.  (Our
> >> first
> >> time through, they took forever trying to get something to register on
> >> their
> >> meters and they kept trying to re-start it when the gasoline engine
> shut
> >> down and it was just running on the electric motor.) I imagine we'll be
> >> looking for something to replace DH's car when I can find work again.
> >>
> >> There are Prius and other hybrid web-sites.  You might want to go read
> >> some
> >> of the comments from other consumers.  I think you would be pleasantly
> >> surprised.   Besides, the hybrid industry is relatively new.  I look
> for
> >> magnitudes of improvements to make them even more efficient in the
> >> future.
> >> Just in the few years we've had our hybrid, great strides have been
> made
> >> in
> >> mileage and other features.
> >>
> >> I'd like to know what kinds of vehicles the authors of the research and
> >> the
> >> author of the editorial drive.  For many people, it seems, a car is
> >> something very personal and tied to their status/personalities.
> >>
> >> Blessings,
> >> Bonnie (SW OH - zone 5)
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: owner-gardenchat@hort.net [mailto:owner-gardenchat@hort.net] On
> >> Behalf
> >> Of Kitty
> >> Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2006 10:00 AM
> >> To: gardenchat@hort.net
> >> Subject: [CHAT] hybrids
> >>
> >> Interesting editorial in today's paper.  The author cited research done
> >> by
> >> Reason magazine, National Geographic, CNW Marketing, Weekly Standard
> >> magazine.  NG I've heard of but I know little about the other 3, so I
> >> wonder
> >> if you hybrid drivers might refute or agree with the various parts of
> it.
> >>
> >> "...the market doesn't support them.  They may be PC, but hybrids would
> >> get
> >> nowhere w/o govt and mfg subsidies.  Car companies take losses on the
> >> cars.
> >> Hybrids cost about $6000 more to make than similar gas-powered cars and
> >> consumers won't shell that out - whatever their politics - and so
> buyers
> >> require the subsidies"...  "..hybrids lack power..."  "They don't get
> >> near
> >> the great gas mileage we're told they do"... "after a 2yr study on
> 'dust
> >> to
> >> dust' energy costs of the cars - meaning the energy to plan, build,
> sell,
> >> drive, and dispose of - the hybrids don't stack up well against
> >> gas-powered
> >> counterparts...don't last as long - around 100,000 miles vs 300,000 for
> >> traditional powered vehicles"
> >>
> >>
> >> Kitty
> >> neIN, Zone 5

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