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RE: CULT: Murphey's and Borer


Hi,
If you have winter growth on your Iris you need to
continue the treatment with Merit so you have full
strength when the borers do come out.  For the
little it costs, better to be protected don't you
think?

I put the Merit down right after a rain or in the
very early AM while the ground is still damp and
before I see a half inch of leaf growth.  When it
is wet it can't blow away then.  I do use it twice
a year.  One to kill and one as a preventative.

Char 

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-iris@hort.net
[mailto:owner-iris@hort.net] On Behalf Of jgcrump
Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2006 3:52 PM
To: iris@hort.net
Subject: Re: [iris] CULT: Murphey's and Borer

Having battled borers in the midwest and here in
the upper south for more than 30 years, I have
seen my share of them.  As I mentioned in my
recent post (same subject), I used Cygon for many
years and found it very effective.  I agree that a
systemic is what is needed to kill them.  What may
not be so clear, however, is how they operate and
what that has to do with their vulnerability.

The borer moth is a night flyer, which is why it
is seldom seen.  As John mentions, it lays its
eggs in the detritus around the base of the plant.

That may include within the leaves at the base of
the fan, which scrupulous 
cleaning of the bed still won't reach.   When the
critters hatch, they are 
microscopically small, and they crawl up the leaf
toward its tip,  where they begin chewing at the
edge of the leaf, going downward, until they
actually enter the leaf and continue eating their
way toward the rhizome, 
getting bigger all the time.   The method of
spotting the borer in the fan 
and killing it by pinching the fan has been
described and even illustrated 
in, I think, the Bulletin!   If not, then it was
the Region 4 newsletter. 
The piece starred Clarence Mahan as the
Executioner.  (I think I even recall simulated
sound effects.) While this method of eliminating
the enemy may be personally satisfying to some, I
have never mastered it and am not particularly
attracted to it anyhow.  Which is not to say that,
if I spot a 
borer at that advanced stage, I won't attempt it!
The thing is, when 
things have reached that stage, untold numbers of
the infiltrator's cohorts are busily boring away
in other clumps.  So, we want to get them earlier.

The borer eggs will hatch, I am told, when the
first warm days of late winter arrive.  I believe
it, based on experience.  That's usually late
February here.  In Indiana, it was early March.
So, that is when I apply 
either Cygon (in days past) or the Merit
(nowadays).   I only do it once. 
I also do not spray against the borer in the fall,
because I'm convinced that the treatment is only
effective on the larvae, not the eggs.

All of the above said, I should mention that I
believe there is a second borer hatch that occurs
in late May or early June.  That is because I have
found tiny borers in the iris after pods have
developed.  I think Charlie Nearpass believed
that, too, since he sprayed his seedlings with
Cygon while they were in bloom.  I can't bring
myself to do that.  Try it, if you wish, 
and you'll see some sick puppies for a few days.
I think you might use 
Merit without that staggering effect, but I
haven't felt I need to try it yet.  --  Griff


----- Original Message -----
From: "John I Jones" <jijones@usjoneses.com>
To: <iris@hort.net>
Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2006 2:43 PM
Subject: Re: [iris] CULT: Murphey's and Borer


> Being in borer free country, I don't have much
knowledge of their life 
> cycle, but as I understand it, they eat their
way down in side the  leaves 
> and through the rhizome and out into the ground.
There they  metamorphcize 
> into the moths that then lay their eggs on the
leaves/detritus around the 
> plant. The eggs hatch and they start  crawling
around looking for leaves 
> to eat.
>
> Seems that the oil might be effective in
smothering the eggs  (fall/spring 
> application) and perhaps the small first stages
of the 
> worm/caterpiller/borer (spring application)
>
> Musings from the uninformed.
>
> John
>
>
> On Feb 11, 2006, at 11:26 AM, Michael D.
Greenfield wrote:
>
>> I do not see how the oil would smother the
borers as they are inside  the 
>> leaves or rhizomes. The reason contact
chemicals do not work.  Poison put 
>> on the outside of the leaf do not work either.
They seldom  eat the 
>> outside of the leaf. It has to be something
absorbed by the  plant such 
>> as Cygon or Merit. Merit granules have not
worked for me. I  plan to use 
>> the liquid this year.
>>
>> I sprayed Cygon in 1999 and found the first two
borers in 2004. When 
>> digging in 2005 quite a few were found. Before
1999 I had a ton. The  old 
>> wife's tale of one borer per rhizome is untrue.
I have seen as  many as 
>> 50 in a two year old clump. A friend had that
clump and we  marked it so 
>> I could get a start. There were none left just
rotting  iris and a 
>> churning mass of borers. Have not seen anything
like it  since. I have 
>> found two borers in one rhizome since. Quite a
few  times.
>>
>> I have a small garden so good clean up spring
and fall is not hard. 
>> usually dig every two years and do row couture.
Planting in beds with 
>> other flowers makes borer control harder.
Growing Spurias and  Siberians 
>> gives borers a place to hide and place leaves
as they are  not dug as 
>> often. Plus good clean up on Siberian is almost
imposable.
>>
>> The first borer I ever found was a full grown
one eating a bee pod on  a 
>> 40" + stalk. I have never seen that since. I
dug everything and  found a 
>> lot more. If borers were on the west coast I am
sure there  would be 
>> studies done to find out better controls.
>>
>> Mike Greenfield
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "John I
Jones" 
>> <jijones@usjoneses.com>
>> To: <iris@hort.net>
>> Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2006 11:13 AM
>> Subject: Re: [iris] CULT: Murphey's and Borer
>>
>>
>>> If it is the oil that kills the borers (I
imagine by suffocating  them) 
>>> then perhaps a good solution (no pun intended)
would be  SunSpray 
>>> Ultra-Fine Oil. It is an ultra refined
parafinc oil. I use  it here in 
>>> California to control Whitefly. Pests don't
develop an  immunity to it 
>>> because of the way it works. Non-toxic.
>>>
>>> http://www.sunocoinc.com/market/ultrafinef.htm
>>>
>>> They don't list any borers o\r the like, but
that just means they 
>>> haven't tested it.
>>>
>>> John
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Feb 11, 2006, at 7:27 AM, George Schubert
wrote:
>>>
>>>> Murphy's sounds good, obviously much cheaper
than the Merit granules 
>>>> or spray, and probably better for the
environment.  Having said  that, 
>>>> we must remember to reapply weekly and after
rains, else bad  things 
>>>> happen. For me, I know that bad things would
happen.
>>>> At 10:10 AM 2/11/2006, you wrote:
>>>>> In a message dated 2/11/2006 10:05:21 AM
Eastern Standard Time,
>>>>> Autmirislvr@aol.com writes:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1/2 cup  of Murphy's Oil Soap to 1 gallon
water.
>>>>>
>>>>> Weekly sprayings  commencing prior to the
appearance of the first 
>>>>> borers and
>>>>> continued  through bloom season.  Reapply
after rain.  Use in 
>>>>> conjunction
>>>>> with
>>>>> good cleanup.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thought I'd pass this along!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Actually l, remebered \ this last week when
I was swabbing the 
>>>>> floors around
>>>>> here. This was alsom mentioned on the list.
>>>>>
>>>>> Did anyone ever try this? I recently heard
one of the 
>>>>> horticultuists--and
>>>>> she actually is a pro--at the local
greenhouse recommend a dilute 
>>>>> Murphey's
>>>>> solution to a woman who had cooties on some
houseplant. I'm still 
>>>>> asking if
>>>>> anyone hass ever tried a light dormant oil
on the irises for borer, 
>>>>> which  amounts
>>>>> to the same thing, I guess. Or does it? Is
it the soap part of 
>>>>> Murphey's
>>>>> which is doing the deed, if the deed is
being done, or is it  the  oil 
>>>>> residue, or
>>>>> is it both?
>>>>>
>>>>> Cordially,
>>>>>
>>>>> Anner Whitehead
>>>>> Richmond VA USA USDA Z7
>>>>>
>>>>>
--------------------------------------------------
------------------ 
>>>>> -
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>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> John                | "There be dragons here"
>>>                          |  Annotation used by
ancient cartographers
>>>                          |  to indicate the
edge of the known world.
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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>>
>
>
> John                | "There be dragons here"
>                          |  Annotation used by
ancient cartographers
>                          |  to indicate the edge
of the known world.
>
>
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>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.15.6/257
- Release Date: 2/10/2006

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