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Re: HYB: Daylight independent

I too had hopes of combining the Forever Blue and Immortality traits together. Thus the cross. Alas it just didn't work. Immortality is a notoriously poor parent and it's weakness, lack of substance just doesn't combine well with FB's narrow petals. The seedlings did gett he worst of each, once locked into this, future generations of this line would be more of the same. Wet tissue paper on a stick that blooms forever just does not have a future, even for those that like form variations. Of couse I tried anyway, but these IBs are very poor at setting seed.

My rebloom work is for good rebloom in cold climate, so how well it does somewere else has no interest for me. Ruby Eruption is an exception to this, as it has such excellent form. The fact that it is a rebloomer in warmer climates increases it's potental as a parent, which was high to start with.

FB just does not rebloom in crowded clumps. I would suggest that you must have very rich soil to get the crowded clumps to keep blooming. My crowded clumps of Immortality just does not do that. I would kindly suggest that what you have is bunch of older rhizomes that are not yet up to bloom size but have been triggered by spring sunlight and bloom when the size trigger has been reached. Already firing pin cocked by the lenght of day and triggered pulled when rhizome size reaches appropriate size. If you had young small rhizomes that did that (without having had winter estivation), it would be more convincing.

I have grown Immortality here for many many years. Many old crowded clumps and lots of freshly planted ones. All the same, bloom end of May, rebloom Mid August. No signs that would convince me that it is daylight independent.

Chuck Chapman

Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 07:38:34 -0500
From: Linda Mann <lmann@lock-net.com>
Subject: [iris] Re: HYB: Daylight independent

Chuck, it took a lot of attempts before I was able to get IMMORTALITY to
survive here.  The attempt that was finally successful consisted of
planting about half dozen rhizomes in several different locations
(varying soil and microclimate).

As a result, there are 6 thriving, fairly large colonies of IMM here,
each of which usually sends up more than one bloomstalk.  I do not dig
and reset any of my plants (except to rescue/line out seedlings), just
thin them out to take donations to club rhizome sales.

As a result, these clumps consist of rhizomes of all sizes and ages.
They send up stalks at various times until temperatures get too hot (not
sure how hot).  Earliest stalks are usually badly damaged by late
freezes, sometimes frozen out completely, but they are still there.
Bloom stalks therefore are coming up from about the time the SDBs are
blooming until the very latest of all the oncers.  These clumps also
send up stalks any time summer temperatures are cool enough to trigger them.

I'm not suggesting that the <genetics> of rebloom in FOREVER BLUE and
IMMORTALITY are the same - your data seem to prove that isn't the case.
  But my experience with IMM is that bloom is daylight independent as
long as temperatures are cool enough.

Do you know what the stalk to fan ratio for FOREVER BLUE and IMMORTALITY is in your growing conditions? The stalk to fan ratio for IMM is really
low here - I'd guess 1 stalk for 10 fans. Or worse.

Point I'm trying to make with all this rambling is that maybe your IMM X
FOREVER BLUE seedlings would have proved to be daylight independent if
you'd grown them to enormous clumps.

Not exactly a desirable trait!  IMM can certainly produce a lot of
babies with weedy foliar growth and few bloom stalks.

And I'm not sure what the physiology might be.. implies slow/impaired?
maturation of rhizomes to blooming size.


- --
Linda Mann east Tennessee USA zone 7/8
East Tennessee Iris Society <http://www.DiscoverET.org/etis>
Region 7, Kentucky-Tennessee <http://www.aisregion7.org>
American Iris Society web site <http://www.irises.org>
talk archives: <http://www.hort.net/lists/iris-talk/>
photos archives: <http://www.hort.net/lists/iris-photos/>
online R&I <http://www.irisregister.com>


Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2008 10:01:04 -0500
From: autmirislvr@aol.com
Subject: Re: [iris] Re: HYB: Daylight independent

<<Point I'm trying to make with all this rambling is that maybe your IMM X FOREVER BLUE seedlings would have proved to be daylight independent if you'd grown them to enormous clumps.>>

Linda has a valid point here.? Rebloom traits do not always show up in that first dozen or so fans that form in the hybridizer's garden.?

So far Summer Radiance has never fall bloomed for me; however, it has done so for both Robin Shadlow(NE) & Mike Lockatell (VA).? It likes both their gardens better than mine!? It bloomed in late June or early July in the display garden in Bowling Green but, to my knowledge, it never fall bloomed.? I introduced it in 1996 and?didn't heard of this trait until a couple of years ago.? It was always just a REPEAT bloomer.? However, the repeat is usually about 50-60 days from the beginning of it's spring bloom.?

It's quite possible that the FOREVER BLUE X IMMORTALITY seedlings might summer bloom in zones 6 or 7.? My typical TB bloom season, in my garden, is the third week of April through the third week of May.? Give or take.? Starts with rebloom seedlings and plicatas and works through the late ones like Breaking News, Nehalem Bay (both reported CA rebloomers) and Candy Clouds (carrier with Holday Lover in linage) finishing up the late season.?

I've had TB stalks in?April, May, June, July, August, September, October, November and December.? Not all at the same time, or even in the same year.? Just in the same garden.? (2004, 2005 & 2006)? ?

Is the difference in the genes or the modifiers??

Part of the mystique of rebloom is that all gardens are not created equal!?

Betty Wilkerson/south central KY/Zone 6?
"Only those who dare to dream, can make a dream come true"??

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