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Re:HYB: daylength independent

I did some checking on my summer temperatures. Usually I'm running 0.9-10.0C minimum until mid August, and go up to 13C plus after that, and two weeks or so later get bloom on Immortality. This summer I went up to higher night time minimums about 3 weeks earlier and had rebloom on Immortality 3 weeks earlier. I'm, suspecting minimum night temperatures may be the deciding factor. This and extra light are the two items to watch. A min/max themometer are quite cheap, about $15.00 .

Another factor I've looked at is Iris aphylla. A lot of clones are winter dormant. That is they drop their leaves in fall. With this factor they don't need an estivation gene.It is a system redundency. Thus they may not need estivation to supress fall bloom. Thus any variety getting the defective FLC (flowering locus C) will bloom in fall when it also is lacking winter dormancy genes. An assumption of course. The FLC genes normally supress flowering and are turned off by estivation. A lot of first and second generation seedlings from aphylla will rebloom

I had looked up Forever Blue and What Again, and did trace back to some aphylla ancestry.

Chuck Chapman

       [iris] Re: HYB: daylength independent
       [iris] Fw: overseas shipping [for Denise Stewart]


Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2008 15:05:30 -0500
From: autmirislvr@aol.com
Subject: [iris] Re: HYB: daylength independent

Chuck, I want to thank you for the time and energy you spent on this discussion of daylength independent and all of the research that went into it.? Maybe it helped some of us wrap our minds around the concept.?

It would be great if we all conducted experiments this spring and summer and reported the results here, or at least if those of us that do conduct experiments report them in detail so the rest may benefit.? Like one big research lab.?

My planting of IMMORTALITY looks like it needs a move, but I don't have a greenhouse.? Just another bed, somewhere!? If it wasn't planted where a path needs to be, I'd just spread a bag of Linda's remedy!?

I think I'll try a piece of Immortality there. A worthy experiment.?
Everyone make those rebloom crosses this spring!? At least one!?
(Just my way of trying to ignore the ice/snow storm advancing across the country.)?

Betty W./South Central KY/zone 6
"Only those who dare to dream can make a dream come true."

- -----Original Message-----
From: irischapman@aim.com
To: iris@hort.net
Sent: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 9:08 pm
Subject: [iris] Re: HYB: daylength independent

Everything in greenhouse was well watered. Outside did get very dry.?
Heat dormancy seems to differ in trigger temperature from plant to plant.?
But.. I suspect biggest factor is that it had more plant energy as it had a longer growth season and warmer growing conditions.?
I think I'll try a piece of Immortality there. A worthy experiment.?
I've gone through all the reports that I could find of hybridizing results. Mostly same reports as Betty. Results vary greatly, even in line breeding where all the factors should eventually line up. If there were a reblooming gene , there would be better results by now. By comparison, my results of Forever Blue X What Again and Forever Blue x Victoria Falls are an exception. FB X WA, every seedling rebloomed. Some were Fall cyclic rebloomers but about 1/4 were daylight independent. FB X VF, it would seem to have been 100% rebloomers, all fall cyclic. A number never got to put up fall flowers, but did have bloom stalks developing. In contrast, no rebloomers at all in crosses to the summer bloomers, such as Immortality, Baby blessed etc. And I did try a lot of crosses.?
As I checked further and further, I've found time and time again, reports of rebloomers coming from crosses of different species, either F1 or F2. Rebloom is not a genetic trait as a gene, but a combination of genes. Thus one species has a certain signal to stop fall bloom and another has a different trigger. When species 1 set of genes lines up with species two genes in same plant, signal to stop fall bloom just does not stop it, wrong languages and no translator. Thus a double recessive set. Then each set of rebloomers has its own sets, from different species . Then a plant can have the two sets of genes , but never be able to rebloom as on top of it all, plants need the faster maturity rate and energy, which can come from a number of factors.?
The same species when crossed to another species to produce rebloomers, does not seem to produce rebloom the same way when crossed to others of same species. The exception to this is clones of aphylla crossed to each other. Yet aphylla 56-61A , which produced rebloomers when crossed to Wine Red (another aphylla clone) does not produce rebloomers in open pollinated seeds, which I had assumed were selfed seeds. So, the theory that each clone carried rebloom gene is correct, then a selfed plant should produce rebloomers. I'll make a note to self aphylla 56-61A when it blooms this year., so I can check this further. But as I don't have climate where the original cross grew, I'll need some volunteers in warmer climes. Any volunteers??
Chuck Chapman?

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