Re: About this "having a war" business.... eBay, nematodes, and maybe Hostas...
- Subject: Re: About this "having a war" business.... eBay, nematodes, and maybe Hostas...
- From: D* T*
- Date: Thu, 05 Jul 2001 02:59:25 -0000
Andrew, some of this note is hilarious! The part about matching
shoes--ROTFL!!! And such a wonderul piece of Andrew apologia. Just about
the time one thinks you should head out to the hosta patch and stay there a
while, out you come with a gem such as this! I'm trying to imagine (never
having met Bob) how he likes being a Bobbsie with you! Too wonderful!
Diann
>From: "Andrew Lietzow" <andrewl@hostahaven.com>
>Reply-To: hosta-open@mallorn.com
>To: <hosta-open@mallorn.com>
>Subject: Re: About this "having a war" business.... eBay, nematodes, and
>maybe Hostas...
>Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 12:16:14 -0500
>
>Hi Bob and marvelous list,
>Thanks for the post, Bob. And, I will apologize in advance, but this is a
>long reply--a tome as Mike Lemke likes to call them. (And if you don't
>read
>this, Bob, you're going to miss my apology hidden deep inside this).
>
>RE:>>"If I need to apoligize to him for that, fine". Andrew told me himself
>he was having problems because he sold plants on ebay that he hadn't got
>from a tissue culture lab.
>---------
>I was thinking this was a problem on the supplier's part, not mine. You are
>correct. A long time ago, in what seems like another lifetime, I was naive
>enough to think that if a nursery supplier was a really big one, their
>chances of being very reliable were good. I was mistaken. I learned that
>lesson. It was as much my fault as theirs because I have been a consultant
>to the W/D durable goods industry for 15 years and implement systems to
>prevent such inventory nightmares. I expect people to post "out-of-stock"
>if they are on top of things, or advise people if an out-of-stock condition
>continues for long, but this did not happen. If you are going to list it,
>but don't have any in stock, you're only going to make your customers
>angry,
>so why do it? If you will look at my posting on eBay now, you will see
>that we try very hard to list ONLY product that we are 99% sure we have in
>stock at the time we list it. And, while I have no trouble whatsoever in
>purchasing well-rooted liners as a plant for my garden, I know some in the
>industry frown on this and we have voluntarily chosen to limit such
>listings. For those in the industry that have a problem with selling
>liners
>because they might die over the winter, I lost plants last winter that I've
>had for multiple years but had few problems with my liners. Guess the
>voles
>saw the bigger ones as a bigger meal? Winter and voles happen.
>
>I have discovered that not everyone agrees regarding the definition of a
>well-rooted liner when it is shipped from a supplier. There is no industry
>standard--well, maybe there is, yet how does one enforce such a standard?
>I
>now know that it is not anything that is universally followed and may even
>be ignored, though stated as policy.
>
>IMO, the main reason Bob and I have ANY problems at all is that we are too
>much alike. Scary thought I know, but it's probably reality. When I came
>to Waukon and saw what you were doing, working on a computer in your
>basement, purchasing the latest plants and falling in love with them, but
>more than willing to share them with other Hostaholics through sales and
>even as gifts, I started to see that you and I were entirely too much
>alike.
>Yikes!!! I looked in the mirror and I saw... . YOU! Oh NO!!! (Shoot, I
>even enjoy that computer generated music on you web site!)
>
>Then, there is the deal with the shoes. I saw those shoes as a simple
>solution to a problem I have with my wife about coming in to the house with
>dirt on my feet. They were simple, slip-on canvas shoes, but I wanted a
>pair for myself. When I got home, I was on a quest to find them and so I
>now have a pair just like them. Oh, I wasn't saying "I want to be like
>Bob", but our personalities appear to be just too darned similar. So
>unfortunately, my good Hostaman from Waukee, we look like the Bobbsie
>Twins.
>We're both in the computer business and we both sell Hostas. Now that I
>have said that, you'll probably go out outside, throw up and go buy a
>different pair of shoes. I think people who understand psychology know what
>a problem it is when you try to force two abstract random thinkers to get
>along. Ain't gonna happen. It's okay; we can deal with it.
>
>As for feedback on eBay, it's the toughest way to sell Hostas of which I am
>aware. EVERY SINGLE TRANSACTION is scrutinized and the buyer gets to
>comment on every single purchase. Do we know how challenging that is? If
>you go and purchase a Hosta at XYZ outlet, you get to see what you are
>purchasing. To take it home and NOT like it you would have to admit that
>you are a moron! Cognitive dissonant prevents this from happening. The
>plant is right before your very eyes and you know you'll love it.
>
>When you purchase mail order you don't get to see the actual product and
>you
>are trusting the seller and their reputation. If you don't like it, you
>talk
>to the vendor and you get it straightened out, but you don't typically blab
>that all over the internet (although that is changing, too). With eBay,
>and
>now with the HL.org auction, things are totally different. Your service
>HAS
>to be exemplary and your plants have to be excellent. Perfect? Probably
>not, but you should see the discussions that people have about ONE little
>plant from this seller or that one (e.g. Gardenweb.com forum) . And Helen
>is right, the news travels quickly and it IS spread all over the
>internet!!!
>And Helen is right again because it is MUCH worse than taking out an ad in
>the newspaper. On the internet, such comments are archived and people can
>find them for weeks or even years. In the paper, hardly anyone would
>notice
>and fewer would even try to find the comment.
>
>Now about these pests and predators of Hosta....
>
>As you recall, I was discussing this with you, Bob, in private and now it
>is
>public. Now that it is public, let me say this about that. I have visited
>with people all over the country about this issue. Any commercial grower
>who is not aware of the potential problems with nematodes, especially with
>crops raised in the ground, is living under a rock. Now, it is likely that
>Bob is 100% correct and all of your/his buyers are 100% correct, that
>they've never had any sign of nematodes. Rather than blowing this all out
>of proportion, however, I had preferred to take a scientific approach to
>this issue. Want to put some serious focus on an effort to combat this
>problem, whether it be shared or exclusively mine with just a couple of
>plants. Alerting you only AFTER I knew what I was talking about was my
>preference.
>
>Nemotodes are all over. There are nearly 20,000 described species. They
>are in the most of the ground you walk on while in your garden.
>Fortunately,
>very few species attack the foliage of Hosta. Aphlenchoides fragalaria
>(from memory, so possibly spelled incorrectly), is listed as the primary
>culprit for Hostas. There are many curative measures that allow humans to
>control their populations, or maybe even eradicate them, though this might
>be too extreme a course of action. Zerotol and Nemacur are options for
>those who are chemically inclined. If you are not chemically inclined,
>then
>you can do like some growers recommend--throw your plants away, sterilize
>the soil, then start over. IMO, that also is too drastic a measure because
>Nematodes tend NOT to kill Hostas but simply make their leaves look ugly.
>
>I believe with Zerotol you do not need a chemical applicators license. With
>Nemacur you do, as it is a restricted use pesticide. I took Dan Nelson's
>advice and obtained a Chemical Applicators License, paid the $250 for a bag
>of Nemacur, bought the jump suit, and am ready to mount an assualt should
>the need arise. They tend NOT to infest Hosta that are growing in
>containers, so this should not be a problem for that type of product (but
>those who grow in containers have other problems, primarily crown rot this
>for another day). In your gardens, after a wet spring, look for them. As
>we are having a very wet spring, likely be followed by a hot dry spell, the
>probabilities for infestation are getting much higher. In Iowa, and I
>believe in many parts of the country, the occurrance of foliar nematode
>infestations is on the increase because of our decreased use of other
>pesticides.
>
>I know there are all types of people on this list, from beginners to
>full-fledged Hosta mavens who will be recorded in the annals of history for
>their contributions to the field. I have learned a lot from the folks on
>this list serve, and I am very open to learning more. When I offend
>people,
>it is not on purpose. I ask a lot of questions, I make mistakes, and I
>hopefully learn from them. I believe most people on this list are simliar
>in their desire to learn. One old adage that I really like is, "To be
>successful faster, just make your mistakes quicker!". Isn't that the
>truth?
>
>While I was watering at the greenhouse yesterday, I thought about this
>"war"
>with Bob, how Bob was reacting to it and how some of you folks are reacting
>to this. Bob and I are like magnets that are both North poles--perhaps like
>Jim Hawes and Ben Zonneveld. Maybe that is okay because what would some of
>you do for entertainment were it not for such embroiled discussions?!?
>Sure, we should get divorced, but since it's an open list and we both like
>Hostas very passionately, we'll probably have more feuds in the years
>ahead.
>Don't worry about it because I believe we'll both forget about it and drive
>on. And, we learn from these types of interactions! What a boring world
>if all of the scientists were to agree, all the computer jockeys, all the
>doctors, all of the Hosta gardeners, etc. Who wants everyone to be devoid
>of passion? Not I.
>
>I want to publicly state this to Bob. I know it took strength to write
>that
>last message, and I appreciate it. But I wonder if you KNOW just how much
>you are changing the world from your little oasis up there in Waukon,
>Iowa--at least the Hosta world. Please accept MY apology for asking so
>many
>questions that tick you off. I don't do it for any other reason than
>having
>a voracious appetite for learning.
>
>And one last thing, for Bob, or others who might have made it down this
>far:
>RE:>>I would be in hot water then as well.
>
>Bob, if you aren't in hot water, and rather frequently, you aren't making
>much happen. It's a fact.
>
>Hosta la Vista!
>
>Andrew Lietzow
>#1 Plantsman at http://HostaHaven.com
>1250 41st Street
>Des Moines, IA 50311-2516
>
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