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Re: Personal Attacks (Last comment on-list)

Whether the characterization of the lady in question is true or not, it is
still a personal attack. Truth only enters into the picture when the issue
of libel (or slander; is email considered "print" or not?) is raised. For
example, would you have called her a "nigger" if she was African-American?
Truth to be sure, but still highly offensive and not appropriate for

I have no doubt that you WERE abused, and that your recounting of the
EVENTS were factual. I understand your anger and passion and the reason you
brought this up on hosta-open. But I still think the point could have been
made without the epithets used.
And to answer Jim..I am not offended by the WORDS used; I am disturbed at
the WAY they were used.

And I am happy to continue this conversation off-list if you or anyone else
would like. I'd rather talk hosta here.


At 10:23 PM 9/11/99 -0700, you wrote:
>>I think this probably fits my earlier definition of "personal 
>>attack," doesn't it?
>>>At 09:26 AM 9/10/99 -0700, Halinar wrote:
>>>Our then president who was 
>>>and still is a stupid women immediatly spread her legs and said 
>>>anything you command, take me.  The stupid whore didn't think I 
>>>would find out what happened because she told all the board members 
>>>to cover up what occured.  She knew the alligations were false and 
>>>she knew the documentations were forged, or at worse should have 
>>>known they were of suspect orgin, but yet she didn't care.  Her 
>>>first goal was to please the big shot board member and to please 
>First, as Jim Hawes correctly interperts, telling the TRUTH in a 
>factual matter can never be a personal attack.  I was making the point 
>about the the past and current Presidents of the daylily society to 
>demonstrate that the problems in the hosta society are problems that 
>occure in many other orgainizations.  Now, admittedly, calling the 
>past president of the daylily society a whore may appear to be a 
>personal attack and it certainly would be a personal attack if that 
>word was used without reason.  However, when a person undertakes 
>action that clearly demonstrate that they are acting like a whore, 
>then it can not be a personal attack to call them a whore because 
>their actions clearly demonstrate what they are.  There is a 
>difference between using strong, but correct words and personally 
>attacking someone for no good reason.  Unfortunately, our past daylily 
>society president was/is stupid, so calling her stupid is a factual 
>statement of fact.  The fact is she acted like a whore because she 
>obliged the wishes of the big wig board member to remove me from the 
>robin solely because he had a perosnal grudge against me.  Calling her 
>a whore may sound strong for some people, but the FACT is her actions 
>clearly demonstrate that is a correct word.  The same applies to 
>calling our current daylily society president a coward because his 
>actions are clearly that of a coward - it's just a factual statement 
>of what happened.  
>I'm old enough to have acquired some wisdon, but yet young enough to 
>know I have it, and have a little ways to get to Jim Hawes age.  I've 
>learned there are a lot of people who seem to be nice people when you 
>meet them, but behind the mask lies some real nastiness.  There are a 
>lot of people who are attracted to power and then like to use/abuse 
>that power.  They THINK they are doing good and sometimes their 
>intentions are actually amiable, but they have this strong need to 
>control.  It's impossible to communicate with these people because it 
>is the power that is controling them.  CS is a perfect example of 
>someone being controled by the power she has.  We have the same 
>problem in the daylily society with three Big Brothers that control 
>the robin.  One of them immediately went out and bought a Nazi uniform 
>to wear when he reads the robin email - his nick name is Nazi Ted 
>because his actions are clearly Nazi like.  Like CS he is controled by 
>the power he has because he has a weak personality that doesn't know 
>how to accept power.  If you want to have a clear understanding of how 
>someone can have power and not abuse it and someone who constantly 
>abuses power, and if you are young enough to remember, compare 
>President Eisenhower with our current President!  Some people will 
>lash on to any power they can get regarless of how silly it may be.  
>Joe Halinar
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