Re: MTB Rim versus veins

Chuck, on the test crosses to determine whether this L&S phenomenon were a variant of plicata, my understanding from either or both Keppel and Ghio is that the L&S parent was crossed with an expressed plicata--the basic kind.
 
The seedlings were like those one would expect from a plicata crossed with a non-plicata.  That is not the general sort of result that one would get if L&S were a plicata allele.  Were it an allele, various seedlings would have fallen into the general sort of plicata, luminata, combinations of these two, or glaciata.  As I understand it, no such seedlings were observed.  Both Keppel and Ghio are genetically astute.  I assume they would recognize a plicata variant in the seedlings if there were one.
 
However, as in any good scientific research, a solid test of a matter should be possible to replicate by anyone, provided the same parameters are in place.  The more the matter is tested, the more convincing (or refuted) the result.
 
It is also true that almost any tangerine bearded iris may throw a plicata when bred to them.  Partly that is due to the basic cross Dr. Loomis made between a plicata and a classic-type variegata, from which the first and most significant progenitor of the tangerine-pink bud phenomenon emerged.  Nearly everything with Lycopene-expressed colors except the Sass t-bearded breaks is descended from that cross made by Loomis.
 
I understand that plicatas showed up in David Hall's pink-line seedlings from time to time, but he never thought any of them good enough to pursue.
 
Since the L&S varieties are all, so far, derived from or have tangerine beards, they may *also* carry plicata, which does tend to complicate interpretation of any test crosses.
 
In answer to Bill, my intention in the cross I have and what I hope to have as seeds by summer is to determine if or whether there is any direct connection with Umbrata spot--but we already know the two patterns interact--as witness CINNAMON SUN, and for that matter, NOTORIOUS if I have what they are pegged correctly.  I will be most interested in your results from the QUANDARY crosses.  Interestingly, the patterns interact in a manner similar to that between Umbrata and plicata.  Chuck's suggestion of crosses with some of the latter (especially those of G. Sutton) is a good one and may actually be more useful in sorting out the distinctions than what I had in mind.  Use of EXPOSÉ for such a test might be interesting also.
 
Chuck, yes, in answer to your question about the articles.  I would very much like to see them.  If you have them in electronic form, that would be the simplest (and cheapest!) mode of transmission.  Let me know via personal e-mail what format(s) you have them in, and I will let you know if I can read them directly.  If not, embodying the texts inside an e-mail rather than attached is one very good way around incompatible formats.
 
I find myself quoting you rather often, so having the concrete source materials would be a real asset!
 
Neil Mogensen  z 7 western NC mountains

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