Re: Kupari etc.

Thanks for the information on bloom. I have Kupari here but it hasn't
bloomed for me.

I have been in touch with Dr. Mitic in Croatia and the comment re
Kupari based on collection detail ( actuall several miles inland from
Dubrovnick, not at Kupari, that it very well may be psuedopallida. 
With your permission I could forward photo to Dr. Mitic for comment.

Could you provide history of your cengalti, source of plant and where
collected if that information is known.

I would welcome any dried flowers for pigment analysis. Kupari or
verified cengalti or verified collected pallida, Dalmatic does not
count as a collected species.

Chuck Chapman

--- In iris-species@yahoogroups.com, "David Ferguson" <manzano57@m...>
wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> Finally I have I. pallida 'Kupari' in flower; it is potted, so no 
> problems with rot and whatever else.  I took some photos, so 
> hopefully some will come out well, and I will be able to post them. 
> Still using a 35 mm camera with slide film though, so got'a get them 
> developed.  [Since all our old cameras are failing, we may actually 
> really get a digital soon - maybe.]
> 
> Anyway, I was wondering what the registered height is for 'Kupari'?  
> It's too newly registered for me to look up in my lists, I'm 
> definitely slanted to historics in my literature, and I haven't kept 
> up a subscription to the on-line version of the list.  
> 
> My potted plant topped out at about 28 inches; however, with some 
> minor frost and wind damage to the stalk, the top is bent and some 
> buds were aborted.  It could be that my stalk and flowers are a bit 
> stunted.
> 
> I now know for sure that it is not the same as the white I. pallida I 
> already grow.  One wiff tells that for certain. 'Kupari' is strongly 
> grape scented, while my other white is only very faintly so.  I've 
> got the 'Kupari' inside now, and the whole place is perfumed with 
> just one flower open.  Also, it seems that 'Kupari' have stouter 
> tubers; it flowers earlier (my other white will be at least two weeks 
> till flowers open), but also the spathes on 'Kupari' are more brown 
> (a distinct hint of brown on my other white, but very pale; decidedly 
> brown on 'Kupari').  The flowers on this 'Kupari', this year are 
> equally smallish and very similar to those of the other white in 
> color and form.  I will neet to dig out photos to compare details, 
> since there will be no overlap in bloom this year.
> 
> Perhaps both fit under I. pallida var. illyrica best, but I still 
> haven't grown and flowered plants that come with that name to 
> compare.  They certainly don't look like my three cengialtii 
> cultivars.
> 
> Wanted to cross 'Kupari' with another strongly grape scented I. 
> pallida to get the white genes together with the fragrant genes into 
> a taller plant with larger flowers.  Could be that such a cultivar 
> already exists from the wild, but I've never found it yet.  
> 
> The only candidate that fits on both counts that I have flowers open 
> on now is I. pallida 'Dalmatica'. Alas not a single flower 
> of 'Dalmatica' has a single grain of pollen this year.  Guess I'll 
> save some 'Kupari' pollen for later bloomers. I've never noticed this 
> sterility in 'Dalmatica' before, but in retrospect I'm not sure I've 
> tried to use it as a daddy before.  It certainly sets pods, so is 
> definitely female fertile.  Has anyone else noticed if 'Dalmatica' is 
> perhaps always pollen sterile?  I thought it had been used for a 
> pollen parent in some of the old TB crosses, as with 'Amas' and I. 
> trojana, but maybe I've got that backwards.  
> 
> All the other I. pallida with open flowers are loaded with pollen, 
> and one, the smallish unnamed blue that I have, is equally fragrant, 
> but the silly thing is no larger, and it has a tinge of brown in the 
> spathes (wanted one with pure white spathes - it's just prettier).  
> 
> Not exactly what I was shooting for, but along with seeds from 
> my "other white" (I think also pollinated by the same smallish blue), 
> I should have a line of white I. pallida in a couple of generations. 
> I just won't have the size I want yet.  
> 
> Still hoping to get the larger size, with the fragrance, and cross 
> the whites with some of the "near pallida" yellow diploids to see if 
> I can get to a bright yellow grapey fragrant Iris that looks like a 
> tall I. pallida.  
> 
> I know the yellow I. pallida goal was worked on before, but it seems 
> that they never got there, with the yellow pale, and the plants and 
> flowers still looking and smelling "hybrid".  When the tetraploid 
> TB's came along, were "much better", and took the breeders by storm, 
> the yellow diploid "pallida" idea seems to have been abandoned.  I 
> still like the charm of I. pallida though.
> 
> 
> Well, enough rambling for now.
> 
> Dave





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