Re: Re: HYB: spots (was another terminology question)
iris@hort.net
  • Subject: Re: Re: HYB: spots (was another terminology question)
  • From: C* C* <i*@aim.com>
  • Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 14:35:57 -0500 (EST)
It is a puzzle. I've been pondering this question myself. One possibility, is that the IB are actually 12/12/8/8, that are tall for their class. A gene count would be needed to determine this. Of all the possibilities that I have thought of, this is the one with highest probability.But of course, that doesn't make it the correct answer. 

Chuck Chapman

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Chaney <billchaney@ymail.com>
To: iris <iris@hort.net>
Sent: Tue, Feb 26, 2013 2:01 pm
Subject: Re: [iris] Re: HYB: spots (was another terminology question)
I don't want to distract the discussion that is ongoing, but I can't resist jumping in when Chuck brings up the 12/12/8/8 ploidy because I am trying to understand how some of these IBs are so fertile with TBs and MTBs. Especially if the 12/12 side comes from aphylla background. Would anyone care to comment 
on that or point me to a good source of information?

Thanks
Bill
________________________________
From: Chuck Chapman <irischapman@aim.com>
To: iris@hort.net
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2013 8:06 AM
Subject: Re:
[iris] Re: HYB: spots (was another terminology question)

Amphidiploid is
12/12/8/8  these are SDB

There can't be cross overs between any chromosome
from 8 set and 12 set, as they never pair up in meiosis. Crossovers only occur in paired chromosomes. No pairs = no crossovers. Like, never ever. If they ever did, their would be unbalanced chromosomes, and it wouldn't be viable. 
that is  the  meiotic cell would die, or any zygote formed would die.

IB is
12/12/12/8 So can be pumilla spot, on one of the chromosomes from the "8 
chromosomes"  set.

RE; Chocolate Truffle.  TB X pumilla = SDB  No exceptions.
And for kickers, ruffles" a recessive trait that just isn't present in pumilla species. So where are genes for ruffles coming from? Hell's Fire is a reddish black, with multiple dosages of Ae (check pedigree) Thus all seedlings will be purple in a cross with a yellow. So are you still believing this pedigree? 
Chuck Chapman

-----Original Message-----
From: Linda Mann
<lmann@lock-net.com>
To: iris <iris@hort.net>
Sent: Tue, Feb 26, 2013 10:41 am
Subject: Re: [iris] Re: HYB: spots (was another terminology question)
Amphidiploid version could.

On 2/26/2013 9:09 AM, Chuck Chapman wrote:

The

pumilla spot is only on the "8 chromosome" set. So can't show up
in TB,
Agree, spots are interesting.

TB e-register from pumila, first generation.
There is another one
registered as a TB, but class is probably a typo - it's
IB height.
Others SDB breeding? fertile IBs? cross overs?

CHOCOLATE TRUFFLE
 (Mark Grumbine, R. 2006) Sdlg. MG04-407-7. TB, 29"
(74 cm), EM     S. light
yellow-brown; F. dark mahogany brown, light
yellow area around beards and
shoulders; beards orange; ruffled. Hells
Fire X I. pumila, yellow

eagerly
waiting to see the '39 checklist (Mike, any more TBs registered
from that era
from pumilas?)

Are there more?  What about the pumila spot work that Blyth
was doing,
trying to bring spot 'up' to TB size? Zing Me.
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