Re: Adventure answer

It would be nice to here from these guys from time to time ........ I'm sure they could  put a few questions to rest...
 

Bob
 

"Smithhisler, Paul" wrote:

I mean no disrespect for these growers, but 'Lloyd' and 'Holland' pumpkins
are merely pumpkins grown by these two men.  There is no inherent genetic
property to either name.

I do agree that these two have produced some fine seed lines through close
observance of the genetics of their crosses.  I just wouldn't want new
growers to fall into the same mind-set that I had when first engaging the
hobby.  Just because the Lloyd 909.5 is a hot seed, not all seeds with the
Lloyd name are hot seeds.  Same goes for Holland, or Calai, or Black, or any
other grower's seeds.  Unless they only use their own pumpkin seeds year
after year, they are merely producing Giants the same way as the rest of us,
using the best seed stock (based on their own judgment) they can get their
hands on.  Like many others, both these men are bound to have genetic
combinations that have not produced well.

As many have said before...this is only my opinion!

-Gus

-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Ailts [J*@pharmasan.com]
Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 9:24 AM
To: pumpkins@mallorn.com
Subject: Adventure anwer

Richard was on the right track with his answer.  7 of those 11 biggest
pumpkins shared one common factor, that is each had Lloyd genetics either as
a mother or a maternal grandparent.  Keep in mind that the male pollinizer
had no genetic influence  on the respective 1000lb pumpkin, so disregard the
"father's half"  of the chart.   Hmmmmmm.... what's the signifigance you
ask.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, so bear with me.  And keep in mind that
what I say is all theroretical and highly opinionated.  When I look at the
backgrouds of many of the biggest pumpkins, there appears to be two
"classes" of seeds.  They are the "Holland" based background and the "Lloyd"
based background.  I know that all AG's came from Dill's work many years
ago, but over time these two names seemed to separate genetically.  The
Lloyd seeds (935, 909.5, 875) do have one "Holland occurence" five
generations back from the 935, but this is almost negligable.  With that
explained, consider this:

4 of the largest 8 pumpkins (including the largest) are the result of a
Lloyd x Holland cross.  (1190, 1109, 1096, 1039). To me that holds
importance!! 2 of these 4 that are not are the result of a Lloyd Lloyd
cross. Hmmmmm...  I don't want to go as far as saying that these 4 are
experiencing hybrid vigor, but I do believe that there is something special
about these Lloyd Holland crosses.  As for the Lloyd Lloyd cross, thats a
out of the scope of this post.

Look at some of the hottest seeds right now -815 Checkon, 846 Calai, 723
Bobier, 826.5 Hester, 991 Hunt. These babies are known producers!  Have you
ever stopped to consider why?  And what do these all have in common?  Yep
you guessed it, Lloyd Holland cross.

One more point, 12 of the top 17 pumpkins have geneologies where there are
no common maternal parents back to the 3rd generation.  That may hold merit
as well.

What's the moral of the story here?  I think there are many hidden secrets
in our pumpkin past, and with a little diggin, some of this stuff can come
to light.   Its up to us to interpret it and put it to the test.

I ask all of you to let me know what you think of this stuff. Am I talkin to
deaf ears, is this way off the mark, or am I on to something?   Thanks--

Joe

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