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Re: [Aroid-l] Philodendron stenolobum

  • Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Philodendron stenolobum
  • From: a san juan kalim1998@yahoo.com
  • Date: Sun, 10 Jul 2005 22:29:34 -0700 (PDT)

well, some other people are starting to use the new
name 'P. stenolobum' ;-)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=25463&item=7700041508&rd=1


--- Eduardo Goncalves <edggon@hotmail.com> wrote:

> That makes me laugh... (or cry)
> 
>           The guy said that P. stenolobum is very
> rare and P. williamsii 
> very common. And that material is from Amazonia!!!!
> Well, for those that 
> donīt know, the real P. williamsii is from  the
> coastal forests in eastern 
> Brazil and P. stenolobum is from dryier areas at
> least 500 km to the 
> south... I have just seen P. williamsii in the field
> (last week) but it was 
> too high in the canopy to make a good picture.
> 
>                   Very best wishes,
> 
>                               Eduardo.
> 
> 
> 
> Dr. Eduardo G. Goncalves
> Universidade Catolica de Brasilia
> Curso de Ciencias Biologicas
> Sala M-206, QS 7, Lote 1, EPTC
> CEP 72030-170, Taguatinga – DF, BRAZIL.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> >From: a san juan <kalim1998@yahoo.com>
> >Reply-To: Discussion of aroids
> <aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>
> >To: Discussion of aroids <aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>
> >Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Philodendron stenolobum
> >Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2005 05:15:24 -0700 (PDT)
> >
> >Well, here's an example of how people can exploit
> the
> >confusion regarding P. stenolobum:
> >
>
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=25463&item=3983469256&rd=1
> >
> >That form is very attractive though.
> >
> >--- Julius Boos <ju-bo@msn.com> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > >From : 	Neil Crafter <golfstra@senet.com.au>
> > > Reply-To : 	Discussion of aroids
> > > <aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>
> > > Sent : 	Sunday, July 3, 2005 1:17 AM
> > > To : 	Discussion of aroids
> <aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>
> > > Subject : 	Re: [Aroid-l] Philodendron stenolobum
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello Neil!
> > >
> > > [To 'a San Juan '---Your photo which you so
> kindly
> > > sent of the stem/rhizome
> > > of P. stenolobum seems a PERFECT match for Dr.
> > > Goncalves` B+W photo of the
> > > stem of P. stenolobum on Pg. 9, Fig. 8, of his
> > > article describing this
> > > species in 'Aroideana Volume 25'.]
> > >
> > > Good to hear your voice, mate!   I`m so deep
> into
> > > this discussion (which I
> > > really should back out of at this stage, and
> leave
> > > it to Dr. Goncalves and
> > > Dr. Croat!!!) but your point about the old, 1871
> > > Hooker illustration has
> > > 'tickled' my interest-bone, as the part that I
> love
> > > best about taxonomy is
> > > all the detective work on investigating the
> history
> > > of a plant! (remind me
> > > to tell you about my investigations 'back when'
> on
> > > Dracontium foecundum
> > > Hook. and D. asperum K. Koch, fun fun fun!!   By
> the
> > > way!!!--- Dr. Zhu`s
> > > revision of the genus Dracontium has been
> published,
> > > it is in 'Annals of the
> > > Missouri Bot. Garden 2004, Vol. 91, Number
> 4'!!!)
> > > I`ll reply below each of
> > > your paragraphs (below) as is my want.  
> HOPEFULLY
> > > Dr. Goncalves will ''jump
> > > into'' the discussion with both feet, as he was
> the
> > > person who did the
> > > actual research to decide that P. stenolobum was
> a
> > > new s pecies, different
> > > to P. williamsii, and what P. williamsii really
> > > was/is!!
> > > >>Julius
> > > Very clear and message received. I guess it's
> hard
> > > for us amateurs who  do
> > > not have access to herbarium material,
> microscopes,
> > > gynoeciums and  locules
> > > (let alone flowering material - my old P.
> > > 'williamsii' is at  least 20 years
> > > old and has never flowered) to try and identify
> the
> > > plants in our
> > > collections. <<
> > >
> > > I am surprised that your plant has never
> bloomed,
> > > from what I know it blooms
> > > on a regular basis here in Florida, and hybrids
> have
> > > been created with it
> > > and P. bipinnatifidum!.   It is unfortunate that
> > > most species MUST depend on
> > > examination of the sexual parts, color of dried
> > > herbarium specimens, etc.,
> > > but I don`t make the rules!    I wait till
> someone
> > > tries to do the revision
> > > of Urospatha, I feel that it may yet involve the
> > > smells of the different
> > > species' blooms!
> > >
> > > >For myself, the tendency to rely on what I  can
> > > observe of the plants is
> > > >perhaps overwhelming at times, especially  when
> the
> > > division between
> > > >species may come down to microscopic 
> structural
> > > differences in their
> > > >flowers. Having further examined my  old
> > > 'williamsii' and new stenolobum, I
> > > >am struck by the similarities in  petiole cross
> > > section and trunk
> > > >appearance, with the only apparent 
> 'difference'
> > > being the leaf blade shape
> > > >and its stiffness.<<
> > >
> > > This makes my point exactly, were we in the
> wilds of
> > > Brazil, I would warrant
> > > that we would see populations, ALL being P.
> > > stenolobum, but differing one
> > > from the other in leaf shape, texture, etc.
> > > BUT---as collectors and human
> > > beings, we`d choose only the 'more beautiful'
> plants
> > > from a population which
> > > we`d collect, NOT the more drab, less 'shapely'
> > > specimens!!    This happened
> > > to Lynn, Mary, my brother Hans and myself when
> we
> > > visited Joep Moonen in Fr.
> > > Guyana ( a trip I HIGHLY recomend to plant
> > > people!!), there was a species of
> > > climbing/rambling Philo. there that was
> exceedingly
> > > common EVERYWHERE, even
> > > around the capital city, quite an attractive
> plant,
> > > and we collected a few
> > > as just samples.   BUT---then Joep so very
> kindly
> > > took us to visit his
> > > secret and  'private reserve' population of this
> > > SAME species, a VERY small,
> > > restricted population, all growing in a tiny
> valley,
> > > all growing against the
> > > trunks of stunted trees.   MAN!  WOW!!!  
> HELL!!!!
> > > Extra- long, extra
> > > narrow leaves, shorter, horizontal and BRIGHT
> orange
> > > petioles and leaf
> > > veins, very compact growth habit!!!   We were
> > > allowed, under Joep`s expert
> > > eyes and guidance, to collect only a VERY
> limited
> > > number of tip-cuttings,
> > > thus preserving the population, and these
> cuttings
> > > and their divisions are
> > > treasured by their owners, and when rarely
> available
> > > at auction, go for big
> > > $$ here in Miami!!!   Man GENERALLY selects the
> most
> 
=== message truncated ===


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