Re: [Aroid-l] Re: Arlan`s Philo. adamantinum

**b* l* <l*@yahoo.com>**

Dear Arlan,

Aloha.  That is definitely not Philodendron
adamantinum...compare that leaf with the scans I sent
you and also key it out using Julius Boos'
description.  

Aloha,

Leland 
--- a san juan <kalim1998@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Hmmm...now i'm not so sure what it is...it's very
> leathery and shiny, and the distance to the midrib
> is identical from end to end....
> 
>
http://www.blueboard.com/pahatan/gambar/images/2007_5_8_d5734.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> a san juan <kalim1998@yahoo.com> wrote: No
> problem....let me take a pic and post it....
> 
> Julius Boos <ju-bo@msn.com> wrote: 
> >From :  a san juan 
> Reply-To :  Discussion of aroids 
> Sent :  Monday, May 7, 2007 3:14 AM
> To :  aroid-l@gizmoworks.com
> Subject :  Re: [Aroid] I.D.'ing some Meconostigmas
> ex: Brazil
> 
> Dear Arlan,
> 
> This is good news!   Please send me a jpeg/photo of
> a leaf of the plant in 
> question!!
> Also, check my 'key' below, as some/most of the
> plants that grew from seed 
> labeled as P. adamantinum and P. saxicolum grew to
> be 'something' close to 
> P. bipinnatifidum/'selloum', but are deff. NOT P.
> adamantinium or P. 
> saxicolum!   I just received a photo of one such
> plant, and I will forward 
> it to you after this.
> Also check my 'key' (below)---- in P. adamantinum,
> the distance from  the 
> BOTTOM of the sinuses (divisions) when measured to
> the mid rib DECREASES as 
> you measure them from the tip of the anterior
> division up towards the 
> petiole juncture, while exactly the OPPOSITE is true
> of any P. 
> bipinnatifidium-type plant.   Check and tell me what
> you see in YOUR plant 
> ex: Brian Williams!
> Bear in mind that we should EXPECT the plants grown
> for seed of P. 
> bipinnatifidium to vary from each other, and
> especially when compared to any 
> plant of P. bipinnatifidium in the U.S.A., the
> reasoning being that 
> presumably ALL P. bipinnatifidium/'selloum' here in
> the U.S.A. are out of 
> tissue culture, and so are clones of one another,
> and so will show little or 
> no differences to each other.   The plants from seed
> SHOULD show differences 
> as they are NOT genitically alike!
> 
> The Best,
> 
> Julius Boos
> 
> >>I got one from brian williams labeled "P.
> adamantinum" and it looks like 
> >>it is growing as  such. It definitely is not a P.
> bipinnatifidum at 
> >>least.<<
> 
> Julius Boos  wrote:
> 
> 
>     >From : Julius Boos
>     Reply-To : Discussion of aroids
>     Sent : Friday, May 4, 2007 9:20 AM
>     To : aroid-l@gizmoworks.com
>     Subject : [Aroid-l] FW: Philo. sps. seeds, S.
> Amer. Co.
> 
> 
>     Dear Friends,
> 
>     Bear with me, I believe that we/I am pretty
> close to either solving OR
>     giving up on this facet of my search for
> accuracy in this matter. I have
>     not received any replies from anyone with whom
> Vic Soukup shared seeds, 
> I
>     can only HOPE that a few of you will step
> forward with information.
>     I have made some notes on how anyone can I.D. a
> plant of any 
> Meconostigma
>     sp. mentioned by Vic (below), this may help
> those of us who may STILL 
> have
>     plants mislabeled and grown from seed sent from
> this Company. I could 
> not
>     do a comparison chart as I had  planned, my old
> comp. (or my dumb brain)
>     would not let it be.
>     Google these species, there are GREAT photos out
> there, Arlan San Juan 
> and
>     David Scherberich`s sites come to mind.
>     SO---here goes--
> 
>     Philo. bipinnatifidium.
> 
>     This seems to be the species that MOST of the
> seeds from Brazil, labeled 
> as
>     other species, grew up to be, so I will start
> here. It is a HUGE 
> species,
>     but we may have been dealing with smaller,
> sub-adult plants.
>     Adult leaf blade often over 30" long, many
> divisions that are
>     bipinnifed/divided, secondary divisions
> generally at least 6 cm. long. 
> In
>     juvenile/sub-adult plants there are sometimes no
> bipinnate/secondary
>     divisions.
>     Distances between the bottom of the sinuses (the
> spaces between the
>     divisions) and the midrib INCREASE starting from
> the tip of the leaf 
> blade,
>     and going upwards toward the juncture with the
> petiole.
>      Intravaginal squamules (the many thorn-like
> structures surrounding the 
> point
>     where the petiole joins the rhizome or 'trunk')
> are long (5-12 mm, 2-4mm
>     wide at base), flattened, pointed and
> chessnut-red in color, easily
>     detachable.
>     Leaf-scars on trunk are elongated/oval, aprox:
> 6.5 wide X 5 cm high, 
> colored
>     light gray, with dark gray margins.
>     Petioles sulcate in cross section.
>     (Juvenile plants of this species sometimes can
> resemble P. saxicolum, 
> but at
>     this stage will have NO visible rhizome/trunk).
> 
>     P. adamintinum.
> 
>     This is a SMALL species, leaf blades in adult
> plants from 6 1/2"-13" 
> long!
>     Anterior divisions of leaf blade only sometimes
> have secondary 
> divisions,
>     very small/short, no more than just a 'scallop',
> under 1 cm long.
>     Distances between the bottom of the sinuses and
> the midrib DECREASE as 
> you
>     move from the tip upward toward the juncture of 
> the petiole.
>     Intravaginal squamules decidious (falling off),
> sometimes persistant, 
> small,
>     0.1-0.2 mm.
>     Leaf scars on rhizome/trunk are greenish-gray w/
> chessnut margins, 
> elliptic
>     to
>     Petiole elliptic to round in cross section.
> 
>     P. saxicolum.
> 
>     Another smaller species.
>     Leaf blade no longer then 12"- 18" , divisions
> not as deep as in 
> near/adult
>     P. bipinnatifidium or especially P. adamintinum,
> never divided.
>     As in P. bipinnatifidium, the distances between
> the bottom of the 
> sinuses
>     and the midrib INCREASE from the tip upwards
> toward the juncture with 
> the
>     petiole.
> 
>     P. paludicola.
> 
>     Leaves held errect to semi-errect.
>     No intravaginal squamules on THICK
> rhizome/trunk.
>     Leaf blade with shallow divisions.
>     Distances between the bottom of the sinuses and
> the midrib increase 
> rapidly
> 
=== message truncated ===>
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