Re: gardenwriters Digest, Vol 119, Issue 8

**S* R* <s*@hotmail.com>**

Hey, Lois, condolences on the loss of your trees :( Sad day when a long-loved tree goes down...
I'd think in a two-pronged approach: Something stalwart for the far-off future to enjoy (whether it's another gardener or the squirrels & birds), and something fast for you to enjoy in its soon-reachable prime.
So I'd plant something like an oak for the future, while planning to enjoy its youth. *And* put fast-growing natural understory smaller trees beneath/around it, to enjoy their prime. 
Eastern redbuds would do well and have a lovely graceful shape. Only concern would be kinda delicate form/ texture compared to those no doubt stout rhodies; visual balance would be off a bit but not seeing your place, don't know. You would :) Someone else's suggestion of a pergola would help with that balance if you use stout posts. Or heck, you could plant a climbing hydrangea or even Virginia creeper (if that's not a dirty word, to your sensibilities) on a stout post, for that matter.
Amelackier's also nice but man, it takes a long tiem to reach 20, 25 ft. Hits 10, 12, even 15 PQ, then slows down. Trunk never gets stout. And, like redbud, is fairly delicate in foliage textural effect/visual weight. A clump-form specimen or two of A. arborea might work.
Sugar maples thrive in shade: They naturally sprout in the forest and make up a good part of the understory. And are also beautiful when young (or at any age, for that matter). So you could actually plant only sugar maples, and let teh future gardener enjoy their old age while you enjoy their first flush of life.
And, saving the best for last, if it were me, I might go with a silver beech... heartbreakingly beautiful in all seasons, from youngest sprout to decrepit old age. Just like us :)
What fun, to have such a choice to mull over. Enjoy!

> From: gardenwriters-request@lists.ibiblio.org
> Subject: gardenwriters Digest, Vol 119, Issue 8
> To: gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org
> Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 18:44:17 -0500
> 
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> Today's Topics:
> 
>    1. LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please (loisdan@juno.com)
>    2. Re: LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please (tanya)
>    3. Re: LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please
>       (dargan, mary palmer)
>    4. Re: LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please (rsbirdy)
>    5. Re: LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please
>       (Mary Palmer Dargan)
>    6. Re: LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please (Ellen Zachos)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 13:21:04 -0500
> From: loisdan@juno.com
> Subject: [GWL] LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please
> To: gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org
> Message-ID: <20121215.132104.1576.2.loisdan@juno.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> Hi Everyone,
> 
> Hurricane Sandy uprooted a 30-inch diameter, 60+ foot tall multi-branched
> ash tree that marked the center of the shrub border in our back garden.
> It took with it a half-dozen of its neighboring mature deciduous trees.
> Just in front of it, still in good shape, is a fountain that has a 6-foot
> diameter pond at its base. Thirty-year old Rhodies flanked the tree. This
> was the focal point of the garden. We were able to salvage the fountain
> and pond, the Rhodies and perennials, and are still cutting up the trees.
> 
> 
> My job is to figure out what to put in the ash tree's place, come spring.
> At our age (Medicare-eligible), we want a pretty tree that's fast-growing
> (but not weak), can tolerate the newfound sunspot long enough to produce
> enough shade for my predominantly shady garden to survive, doesn't
> compete with the Rhodies when they're in bloom, and ideally produces
> flowers and/or fruit. We're in Zone 5B (Northwestern NJ) with heavy
> clay/stoney acid soil. The lot is heavily forested, so I want something
> that will fit in with a woodland garden style. In late July and August,
> this space can become very dry.
> 
> We probably won't live long enough to see another forest tree mature, so
> I'm thinking some kind of mid-story (30-feet?), possibly native tree. I'm
> inclined to look for something that has a horizontal spread, but am not
> sure that's the way to go. I'm considering either deciduous or evergreen.
> 
> I'm at my wits' (and reference book/internet search) end and would
> welcome suggestions.
> 
> Merry Christmas!
> Lois
> 
> Lois J. de Vries
> Visit: http://cultivatingtheinnergardener.blogspot.com
> Visit: http://loisdevries.blogspot.com
> On Twitter: http://twitter.com/loisdevries
> On Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/loisjdevries
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 10:52:07 -0800
> From: tanya <tanyagarden@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [GWL] LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please
> To: Garden Writers -- GWL -- The Garden Writers Forum
> 	<gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAA-ju_c29NVAyK3jqU8cZ04juJD_qBA3NgcGv=2nZ5gdJxyx0w@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> How about a shade structure or pergola? Do you have other seating near the
> fountain, or would you be likely to sit out there if you did? Maybe a small
> screenhouse with overhangs? Or an arbor with a fast-growing vine?
> 
> I've had small garden spaces of my own, but if a significant space opens
> up, I'm more likely to use it as an opportunity for a redesign rather than
> a replacement.
> 
> 
> On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 10:21 AM, <loisdan@juno.com> wrote:
> 
> > Hi Everyone,
> >
> > Hurricane Sandy uprooted a 30-inch diameter, 60+ foot tall multi-branched
> > ash tree that marked the center of the shrub border in our back garden.
> > It took with it a half-dozen of its neighboring mature deciduous trees.
> > Just in front of it, still in good shape, is a fountain that has a 6-foot
> > diameter pond at its base. Thirty-year old Rhodies flanked the tree. This
> > was the focal point of the garden. We were able to salvage the fountain
> > and pond, the Rhodies and perennials, and are still cutting up the trees.
> >
> >
> > My job is to figure out what to put in the ash tree's place, come spring.
> > At our age (Medicare-eligible), we want a pretty tree that's fast-growing
> > (but not weak), can tolerate the newfound sunspot long enough to produce
> > enough shade for my predominantly shady garden to survive, doesn't
> > compete with the Rhodies when they're in bloom, and ideally produces
> > flowers and/or fruit. We're in Zone 5B (Northwestern NJ) with heavy
> > clay/stoney acid soil. The lot is heavily forested, so I want something
> > that will fit in with a woodland garden style. In late July and August,
> > this space can become very dry.
> >
> > We probably won't live long enough to see another forest tree mature, so
> > I'm thinking some kind of mid-story (30-feet?), possibly native tree. I'm
> > inclined to look for something that has a horizontal spread, but am not
> > sure that's the way to go. I'm considering either deciduous or evergreen.
> >
> > I'm at my wits' (and reference book/internet search) end and would
> > welcome suggestions.
> >
> > Merry Christmas!
> > Lois
> >
> > Lois J. de Vries
> > Visit: http://cultivatingtheinnergardener.blogspot.com
> > Visit: http://loisdevries.blogspot.com
> > On Twitter: http://twitter.com/loisdevries
> > On Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/loisjdevries
> > _______________________________________________
> > gardenwriters mailing list
> > gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org
> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/gardenwriters
> > GWL list website  http://www.ibiblio.org/gardenwriters
> > GWL has searchable message archives at:
> > http://www.hort.net/lists/gardenwriters
> > If you have photos for GWL, send them to gwlphotos@hort.net and they can
> > be viewed at  http://www.hort.net/lists/gwlphotos
> >
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> If you have a garden and a library, you have everything you need. -- Cicero
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 14:03:00 -0500
> From: "dargan, mary palmer" <mpdargan@dargan.com>
> Subject: Re: [GWL] LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please
> To: Garden Writers -- GWL -- The Garden Writers Forum
> 	<gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAFSDqi2MFfR5JXR8c56FJPPyTMa=eDx=auM3SQh1rUBT+Bmhrg@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> tulip popular is my favorite native fast growing, but not sure of the soil
> conditions. Crateagus ( hawthorn) springs to mind as a spreading canopy,
> once again not sure of soil but native....I am so sorry for your
> misfortune, Lois. xxx
> 
> On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 1:52 PM, tanya <tanyagarden@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > How about a shade structure or pergola? Do you have other seating near the
> > fountain, or would you be likely to sit out there if you did? Maybe a small
> > screenhouse with overhangs? Or an arbor with a fast-growing vine?
> >
> > I've had small garden spaces of my own, but if a significant space opens
> > up, I'm more likely to use it as an opportunity for a redesign rather than
> > a replacement.
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 10:21 AM, <loisdan@juno.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Everyone,
> > >
> > > Hurricane Sandy uprooted a 30-inch diameter, 60+ foot tall multi-branched
> > > ash tree that marked the center of the shrub border in our back garden.
> > > It took with it a half-dozen of its neighboring mature deciduous trees.
> > > Just in front of it, still in good shape, is a fountain that has a 6-foot
> > > diameter pond at its base. Thirty-year old Rhodies flanked the tree. This
> > > was the focal point of the garden. We were able to salvage the fountain
> > > and pond, the Rhodies and perennials, and are still cutting up the trees.
> > >
> > >
> > > My job is to figure out what to put in the ash tree's place, come spring.
> > > At our age (Medicare-eligible), we want a pretty tree that's fast-growing
> > > (but not weak), can tolerate the newfound sunspot long enough to produce
> > > enough shade for my predominantly shady garden to survive, doesn't
> > > compete with the Rhodies when they're in bloom, and ideally produces
> > > flowers and/or fruit. We're in Zone 5B (Northwestern NJ) with heavy
> > > clay/stoney acid soil. The lot is heavily forested, so I want something
> > > that will fit in with a woodland garden style. In late July and August,
> > > this space can become very dry.
> > >
> > > We probably won't live long enough to see another forest tree mature, so
> > > I'm thinking some kind of mid-story (30-feet?), possibly native tree. I'm
> > > inclined to look for something that has a horizontal spread, but am not
> > > sure that's the way to go. I'm considering either deciduous or evergreen.
> > >
> > > I'm at my wits' (and reference book/internet search) end and would
> > > welcome suggestions.
> > >
> > > Merry Christmas!
> > > Lois
> > >
> > > Lois J. de Vries
> > > Visit: http://cultivatingtheinnergardener.blogspot.com
> > > Visit: http://loisdevries.blogspot.com
> > > On Twitter: http://twitter.com/loisdevries
> > > On Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/loisjdevries
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > gardenwriters mailing list
> > > gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org
> > > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/gardenwriters
> > > GWL list website  http://www.ibiblio.org/gardenwriters
> > > GWL has searchable message archives at:
> > > http://www.hort.net/lists/gardenwriters
> > > If you have photos for GWL, send them to gwlphotos@hort.net and they can
> > > be viewed at  http://www.hort.net/lists/gwlphotos
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > If you have a garden and a library, you have everything you need. -- Cicero
> > _______________________________________________
> > gardenwriters mailing list
> > gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org
> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/gardenwriters
> > GWL list website  http://www.ibiblio.org/gardenwriters
> > GWL has searchable message archives at:
> > http://www.hort.net/lists/gardenwriters
> > If you have photos for GWL, send them to gwlphotos@hort.net and they can
> > be viewed at  http://www.hort.net/lists/gwlphotos
> >
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> *LANDSCAPE YOUR LIFE! *
> *Heal the Earth...One Garden at a TIme*
> *create a nourishing, flourishing home utopia *
> *
> *
> *Mary Palmer Dargan, ASLA, APLD, CLARB is America's Landscape Alchemist *
> *Registered landscape architect, Dargan Landscape Architects*
> *404-354-1715 (cell), 404-231-3889 (office) www.dargan.com*
> 
> NEW BOOK! *Lifelong Landscape Design *GibbsSmith(Oct '12) *www.dargan.com*
> *Author :*     *Timeless Landscape Design **www.dargan.com * for
> autographed copies
> *iBook :      **Timeless & Lifelong  are available as  iBook with amazing
> photos!*
> Vimeo:      Lecture videos on line free!
> http://learn.dargan.com/<http://vimeo.com/dargan/videos>
> *Friends:    * http://facebook.com/darganlandscape
> *Follow:      *http://twitter.com/mpdargan
> *Share :*      http://dargan.com/blog
> Speak:
> http://www.greatgardenspeakers.com/listing/marypalmer-dargan.html
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 16:40:18 -0500
> From: rsbirdy <rsbirdy@comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [GWL] LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please
> To: gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org
> Message-ID: <ukw8pwuyw5rv0n76q93rp274.1355607209153@email.android.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
> 
> Lois...
> What about a serviceberry? There are several varieties...nice fall color...blooms...berries...doesn't compete...easy care...to 25ft...adaptable so long as it has drainage...native tree...
> 
> Sandie Parrott
> Writer...Blogger...Photographer
> 
> 
> >From my Android phone on T-Mobile. The first nationwide 4G network.loisdan@juno.com wrote:Hi Everyone,
> 
> Hurricane Sandy uprooted a 30-inch diameter, 60+ foot tall multi-branched
> ash tree that marked the center of the shrub border in our back garden.
> It took with it a half-dozen of its neighboring mature deciduous trees.
> Just in front of it, still in good shape, is a fountain that has a 6-foot
> diameter pond at its base. Thirty-year old Rhodies flanked the tree. This
> was the focal point of the garden. We were able to salvage the fountain
> and pond, the Rhodies and perennials, and are still cutting up the trees.
> 
> 
> My job is to figure out what to put in the ash tree's place, come spring.
> At our age (Medicare-eligible), we want a pretty tree that's fast-growing
> (but not weak), can tolerate the newfound sunspot long enough to produce
> enough shade for my predominantly shady garden to survive, doesn't
> compete with the Rhodies when they're in bloom, and ideally produces
> flowers and/or fruit. We're in Zone 5B (Northwestern NJ) with heavy
> clay/stoney acid soil. The lot is heavily forested, so I want something
> that will fit in with a woodland garden style. In late July and August,
> this space can become very dry.
> 
> We probably won't live long enough to see another forest tree mature, so
> I'm thinking some kind of mid-story (30-feet?), possibly native tree. I'm
> inclined to look for something that has a horizontal spread, but am not
> sure that's the way to go. I'm considering either deciduous or evergreen.
> 
> I'm at my wits' (and reference book/internet search) end and would
> welcome suggestions.
> 
> Merry Christmas!
> Lois
> 
> Lois J. de Vries
> Visit: http://cultivatingtheinnergardener.blogspot.com
> Visit: http://loisdevries.blogspot.com
> On Twitter: http://twitter.com/loisdevries
> On Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/loisjdevries
> _______________________________________________
> gardenwriters mailing list
> gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org
> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/gardenwriters
> GWL list website? http://www.ibiblio.org/gardenwriters
> GWL has searchable message archives at:
> http://www.hort.net/lists/gardenwriters
> If you have photos for GWL, send them to gwlphotos@hort.net and they can be viewed at? http://www.hort.net/lists/gwlphotos
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 18:15:32 -0500
> From: Mary Palmer Dargan <mpdargan@dargan.com>
> Subject: Re: [GWL] LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please
> To: rsbirdy <rsbirdy@comcast.net>,	Garden Writers -- GWL -- The Garden
> 	Writers Forum	<gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <611F1FA2-2550-484E-88FE-B55BE5029FC7@dargan.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=us-ascii
> 
> Lovely idea, the service berry
> 
> On Dec 15, 2012, at 4:40 PM, rsbirdy <rsbirdy@comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > Lois...
> > What about a serviceberry? There are several varieties...nice fall color...blooms...berries...doesn't compete...easy care...to 25ft...adaptable so long as it has drainage...native tree...
> > 
> > Sandie Parrott
> > Writer...Blogger...Photographer
> > 
> > 
> > From my Android phone on T-Mobile. The first nationwide 4G network.loisdan@juno.com wrote:Hi Everyone,
> > 
> > Hurricane Sandy uprooted a 30-inch diameter, 60+ foot tall multi-branched
> > ash tree that marked the center of the shrub border in our back garden.
> > It took with it a half-dozen of its neighboring mature deciduous trees.
> > Just in front of it, still in good shape, is a fountain that has a 6-foot
> > diameter pond at its base. Thirty-year old Rhodies flanked the tree. This
> > was the focal point of the garden. We were able to salvage the fountain
> > and pond, the Rhodies and perennials, and are still cutting up the trees.
> > 
> > 
> > My job is to figure out what to put in the ash tree's place, come spring.
> > At our age (Medicare-eligible), we want a pretty tree that's fast-growing
> > (but not weak), can tolerate the newfound sunspot long enough to produce
> > enough shade for my predominantly shady garden to survive, doesn't
> > compete with the Rhodies when they're in bloom, and ideally produces
> > flowers and/or fruit. We're in Zone 5B (Northwestern NJ) with heavy
> > clay/stoney acid soil. The lot is heavily forested, so I want something
> > that will fit in with a woodland garden style. In late July and August,
> > this space can become very dry.
> > 
> > We probably won't live long enough to see another forest tree mature, so
> > I'm thinking some kind of mid-story (30-feet?), possibly native tree. I'm
> > inclined to look for something that has a horizontal spread, but am not
> > sure that's the way to go. I'm considering either deciduous or evergreen.
> > 
> > I'm at my wits' (and reference book/internet search) end and would
> > welcome suggestions.
> > 
> > Merry Christmas!
> > Lois
> > 
> > Lois J. de Vries
> > Visit: http://cultivatingtheinnergardener.blogspot.com
> > Visit: http://loisdevries.blogspot.com
> > On Twitter: http://twitter.com/loisdevries
> > On Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/loisjdevries
> > _______________________________________________
> > gardenwriters mailing list
> > gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org
> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/gardenwriters
> > GWL list website  http://www.ibiblio.org/gardenwriters
> > GWL has searchable message archives at:
> > http://www.hort.net/lists/gardenwriters
> > If you have photos for GWL, send them to gwlphotos@hort.net and they can be viewed at  http://www.hort.net/lists/gwlphotos
> > _______________________________________________
> > gardenwriters mailing list
> > gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org
> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/gardenwriters
> > GWL list website  http://www.ibiblio.org/gardenwriters
> > GWL has searchable message archives at:
> > http://www.hort.net/lists/gardenwriters
> > If you have photos for GWL, send them to gwlphotos@hort.net and they can be viewed at  http://www.hort.net/lists/gwlphotos
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 18:44:12 -0500
> From: Ellen Zachos <ez@acmeplant.com>
> Subject: Re: [GWL] LS Designers/Plantspeople Suggestions Please
> To: Garden Writers -- GWL -- The Garden Writers Forum
> 	<gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Cc: rsbirdy <rsbirdy@comcast.net>
> Message-ID: <D92252B5-609D-454D-B127-FFCF986DE95C@acmeplant.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> And tasty, too.
> 
> On Dec 15, 2012, at 6:15 PM, Mary Palmer Dargan wrote:
> 
> > Lovely idea, the service berry
> > 
> > On Dec 15, 2012, at 4:40 PM, rsbirdy <rsbirdy@comcast.net> wrote:
> > 
> >> Lois...
> >> What about a serviceberry? There are several varieties...nice fall color...blooms...berries...doesn't compete...easy care...to 25ft...adaptable so long as it has drainage...native tree...
> >> 
> >> Sandie Parrott
> >> Writer...Blogger...Photographer
> >> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> gardenwriters mailing list
> gardenwriters@lists.ibiblio.org
> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/gardenwriters
> GWL list website  http://www.ibiblio.org/gardenwriters
> GWL has searchable message archives at:
> http://www.hort.net/lists/gardenwriters
> If you have photos for GWL, send them to gwlphotos@hort.net and they can be viewed at  http://www.hort.net/lists/gwlphotos
> 
> End of gardenwriters Digest, Vol 119, Issue 8
> *********************************************

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