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Re: no subject and New Column

  • Subject: Re: no subject and New Column
  • From: Jim Hawes <hawesj@atlantic.net>
  • Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2001 10:41:46 -0400


You have every right  to  express your feelings as I have every right to
express  mine. I am not opposed to dissemination of information as you seem to
believe is the purpose of my post. I am not looking beyond what was said. I have
read both posts very carefully and my analytic ability at 80 years of age is
still quite acute. My concern is that there is excessive  built- in control and
manipulation  within  the conditions which Glen has described as how the new
column will operate in developing facts and differentiating them from opinion. I
did not describe the conditions..Glen did. I simply responded to the conditions
which in my view are restrictive and give excessive power to the Arbitrator who
acts as the sole interpreter of Facts as opposed to Opinion.. As a matter of
fact, the Arbitrator assigns himself authority which I believe exceeds any that
any author of any article in the Hosta Journal  has ever assumed.

You may recall that just recently the same kind of excercise was enacted. Andrew
set up a Forum in which he deliniated that he was to be the arbitrator of his
new Forum. He laid down HIS rules and warned any and all that he would excercise
strict control and editing authority within his Forum similar to that exercized
by Carolyn Shaffner in Phoenix and that this was the way the policy was going to
work. I  asked that I NOT be included if this were the case.. Glen's post
reminded me of Andrew's methodology and I posted my reaction.  If you prefer
Glen's methodology, then by all means, join with him and have fun in announcing
facts from opinion..

Mary Chastain wrote:

> Hi Jim, This time I feel that you are looking beyond what is being said. I
> understand and feel the Glem only wants to offer a much needed article to
> the Journal. The majority of its readers are having trouble with so much
> scientific material. The average member wants to know about growing hosta
> and what is considered the better ones to grow, how to improve their
> gardening skills etc. Glen is offering an excellent opportunity for a lot of
> people not on the robin or hosta open to gain from others experience. It is
> an opportunity to share and to grow as writers for the future. As with all
> of the others that give their time and energy to the journal I feel that we
> owe Glen a big thank you for undertaking the project. This is just as we all
> owe you and others for all the wonderful information and help you have
> shared with so many. This is an effort to share on all levels and will not
> be everyone's thing but then nothing in this world meets the needs of all.
> Still waiting to hear of your next visit,
> Mary
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-hosta-open@mallorn.com
> [mailto:owner-hosta-open@mallorn.com]On Behalf Of Jim Hawes
> Sent: Saturday, July 28, 2001 9:12 AM
> To: hosta-open@mallorn.com; hawesj@atlantic.net; gw1944@vermontel.net
> Subject: no subject and New Column
>  Barbara,
> I have read the two recent  posts that Glen Williams  has asked that you
> forward to hosta-open readers.
> There seems to be something behind or within the posts that are puzzling
> to me. I wondered if they  appeared puzzling to other readers as well.
> Let me try to summarize how I interpreted  these posts.
> Glen explained that he was proposing a New Question/Answer Column in the
> Hosta Journal in which he would be the Arbitrator for selection of
> questions to be answered  by appropriate people  he would select. The
> criteria  of the questions and answers to be selected would be whether
> information being discussed was a fact or merely an opinion about a
> subject.. The ground rules included  the prohibition of any questions
> and answers on hosta politics. Glen would use the hosta robins and their
> members as resources for these questions and answers. He solicited
> questions and expected hundreds by Sunday.
> In my mind red flags started to wave, sirens went off and ringing and
> clanging bells suggested that huge trucks with loads of large rocks were
> backing up, indicating DANGER. I asked myself "What is happening?" Why
> doesn't Glen subscribe to hosta-open and discuss this with everyone
> there directly? Is he going to continue discussion each time through
> you? No offence intended, but this seems very clumsy to me.
> Now my questions to Glen....What is hosta politics?  Is this an attempt
> by someone in political power  (such as a former secret hosta policeman,
> for example) to control others  by restrictions/rules/ regulations? Does
> being an Arbitrator give one person power and authority to decide Truth
> (also known as facts) from Fiction (also called mere opinion)? Does
> selection of questions and "correct"  answers
> give undue power and manipulative control to one person? And/or  his
> friends? Who decides whether the Arbitrator is competent in science ,
> for example, to determine fact from opinion?....the Arbitrator himself?
> Hosta-open was created as a media to openly discuss hosta subjects of
> all kinds . It is doing fine with freedom of expression available for
> all to use , express and judge for themselves. I suggest that Glen may
> wish to rejoin Hosta-open and find this out for himself.....but that he
> leave any attempts at Manipulation and Control  of others with Phoenix.
> It is not acceptable at Hosta-open....AND THAT'S A FACT.
> Jim Hawes
> Barbara wrote:
> Glen asked me to post this to the Open Robin. Here is your chance to
> help the
> Journal.
> Date:    Thu, 26 Jul 2001 14:44:51 +0100
> From:    Glen Williams <gw1944@VERMONTEL.NET>
> Subject: Your Questions Please
>                                 Questions Wanted
> I would  really appreciate as many questions as possible from the
> hosta-robin-people for the new Hosta Journal Column.  The title of the
> column was going to be Facts and Opinions on Hostas.  There are some
> other
> good suggestions out there so I will hold off  with a final title. But,
> I
> mention  the original title because it suggests  just what we are
> looking
> for:   questions which can be answered with facts as well as questions
> which will tolerate only opinions. Much of hostadom is still at the
> opinion
> stage....but making steady and stoloniferous process  toward facts. Any
> question and answer column needs to respond to both.
> The audience for such a column is the general hosta  rank and file
> membership, an audience that probably is not as obsessive/compulsive as
> many of us are on the hosta robins.They have a real life from May -
> September....and don't  raise seedlings in the winter.  They are good
> people who simply would like to learn more with just a little effort. We
> aim to please. Then they will buy more hostas, become obsessed , and
> name
> their children after  prominent hostas.
> There have been a lot of  wonderful questions and answers over the past
> few
> years on the robins. Any of those  (with the response) would be a great
> resource. The next resource is you and what you've always wanted to ask
> ,
> did , but got no answer, or were afraid to ask, because  you did not
> want
> anyone to know that  you didn't know what a chimera or a peduncle  was.
> Perhaps it is the unasked questions that you did not want to be seen
> asking
> because they appeared so basic i.e. watering, fertilizing,
> transplanting.......that need asking.    All is fair game for this
> column.
> It won't be a vehicle for hosta politics, but certainly wanting to know
> something about hosta history , our early and later day  hybridizers,
> consumer information, questions about plants and hosta people...it's
> wide
> open, with the one exception.
> So please send me a list of your questions  ( even if they have been
> answered previously), subjects you would like to see explored through
> questions, opinion questions, fact questions, rumors, myths.....nearly
> anything  that the general, non-rabid gardener would want to know about
> hostas.  Maybe some questions for rabid hosta gardeners would be a good
> thing too(there must be some short answers to some  short scientific
> questions).  You can send them to me privately or publicly,  e-mail
> address
> ; gw1944@vermontel.net , phone 802-885-2839, or by snail mail : Glen
> Williams, 20 Dewey St., Springfield , Vermont 05156.
> The weekend is nearly here. Search the nooks and crannies of your mind.
> If
> you want the questions published anonymously that  can be done.  I hope
> to
> be looking at 100's of questions by Sunday.  Then I will start the
> search
> for those people who can answer the questions.  Thanks and thanks again.
> glen W.
> >From the heart of summer in Vermont.... where it is cool and sunny and
> all
> the tourists raise their hands to ask directions.
> Glen Williams
> 20 Dewey St.
> Springfield , Vermont
> 05156
> Tel: 802-885-2839
> Barbara
> MA Z5
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