Re: Re: HYB: another terminology question
iris@hort.net
  • Subject: Re: Re: HYB: another terminology question
  • From: C* C* <i*@aim.com>
  • Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2013 18:22:55 -0500 (EST)
As colour genes are nuclear, and no modifications in colour from extra-nuclear genes, I'd have to say stray pollen or some sort of other error. The next thing I'd look at is soil or location differences.
There can be conformation and size differences in reciprocal crosses, but I haven't heard of anything resulting in colour differences of this degree. I would expect this sort of range of colour that you described, if Peach Spot was partially selfed, and partially crossed to a yellow halo type of iris, or or had a yellow halo iris as pollen donner, that had a orange parent. There is nothing in Highland Chief that could produce these colours. 


Chuck Chapman



-----Original Message-----
From: Betty Wilkerson <autmirislvr@aol.com>
To: iris <iris@hort.net>
Sent: Sun, Feb 24, 2013 3:35 pm
Subject: Re: [iris] Re: HYB: another terminology question

The first year I was making crosses I did a cross between Peach Spot
and Highland Chief and also did the reverse.  'Peach Spot' is a white
iris with a peach spot on the fall.  Highland Chief is a beautiful red
on yellow/cream plicata from Gibson.  Approximately, 30 each way.

All 25+ of the PS X HC were approximately 18 inches tall with four big
blooms.  (Big Bertha even bloomed on fall.)  They all looked alike.
They could have been clones from the same rhizome.  But, they weren't.
They were siblings.

The ones with 'Highland Chief' as pod parent produced a wide variety of
seedlings, all tall and multi branched, some with triple teminals.  A
couple were peach selfs.  One was a bright orange self.  Several had
white falls with yellow standards and fall rings.  It was one of the
most educational and intriguing crosses I've ever made.

They definitely did not look like siblings.  There were no
characteristics in common.  The one batch was VERY ugly, while the
others were all goreous.

How come if they are siblings?


Betty Wilkerson
Zone 6 KY
autmirislvr@aol.com



-----Original Message-----
From: Chuck Chapman <irischapman@aim.com>
To: iris <iris@hort.net>
Sent: Sat, Feb 23, 2013 10:56 am
Subject: Re: [iris] Re: HYB: another terminology question


For sibling cross, it wouldn't make any difference when  cross was made
or which parent was pod or which pollen.Why pod and pollen parent
wouldn't matter  is because the genes controlling  major factors of
colour and pattern are not located in plastids or mitochondria.  As to
getting plant characteristics it would play a role. They are both sibs.
So a sib cross to pull out  or evaluate recessives will still work.But
the reverse cross do have different genetics in terms of extra-nuclear 
 genes,  but are siblings.Chuck Chapman-----Original Message-----From:
Betty Wilkerson <autmirislvr@aol.com>To: iris <iris@hort.net>Sent: Sat,
Feb 23, 2013 11:13 amSubject: Re: [iris] Re: HYB: another terminology
questionSiblings are any seedlings that come from the same cross.
Example:'Treasured' X 'Renown'.  Treasured is the pod parent and Renown
is thepollen parent.A reverse cross would be 'Renown' X 'Treasure'.  It
is not the same.Technically . . . if Linda made the same cross five
years later theywould be siblings.  They are still the same cross.Each
seedlings in a pod is different, even if it can not be seen withthe
naked eye.  So, the fact that the seedlings in Linda's cross wouldlook
different than the ones in my cross would be expected, even thoughthey
would still (most) look like siblings.Does this help?Betty
WilkersonZone 6 KYautmirislvr@aol.com-----Original Message-----From:
Shaub Dunkley <miscaccts@bellsouth.net>To: iris <iris@hort.net>Sent:
Fri, Feb 22, 2013 5:21 pmSubject: [iris] Re: HYB: another terminology
questionHey group -Hope this formats correctly - was unclear about how
to postto the list.  I've lurked for some time on a learning curve.
Long curveto go but gotta stumble in somewhere.It would seem being able
todistinguish between pod sibling and sibling separated by time has
valueworth conserving. Fraternal twins have less chance of
beingstep-sibling. Across time, particularly across years, there is
morechance that records might have got mixed up, or field labels got
mixedup and Daddy Joe then is not Daddy Joe now, etc. (same for Mom).
Mightnot a discriminating (subsequent) hybridizer want to utilize
siblingknown to be from within the same pod if he wanted to critically
improvechances of breeding within a certain gene pool?I'm still
figuring outto sleuth cross information in the registry but it is
apparent somehybridizers use numbering systems that are fairly
transparent as to whoare pod sibling and who are across-time sibling.
Gold stars to them.BTW- are there better terms than pod siblings and
across-timesiblings?Shaub DunkleyAsheville, North Carolina
Z6b-----OriginalMessage----- From: Tom Waters <irises@telp.com> To:
iris<iris@hort.net> Sent: Fri, Feb 22, 2013 9:11 am Subject: [iris]
HYB:another terminology questionWhile we're at it, I'm interested in
howpeople understand the term "sibling". I've seen it sometimes
apparentlyrestricted to two irises that came from the same pod of seed,
or atleast the product of the cross of two plants made by the
samehybridizer in the same year. It seems to me that since the two
parentsare clones, any irises with the same parentage are siblings,
even ifthe crosses that produced them were made many years or miles
apart bydifferent people. My own brother and sisters, for example, are
no lessmy brother and sisters for having been gestated separately at
differenttimes. ;) Tom Waters Telperion Oasis ~ www.telp.com/irises
Cuyamungue,New Mexico, USA (zone 6)
----------------------------------------From:"Tom Waters"
<irises@telp.com>Sent: Friday, February 22, 2013
7:22AMTo:----------------------------------------------------------------

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