Genetic experiment-Southern Hemisphere growers needed

	(this is a  long one so please bear with me.)

	As the 99 pumpkin season comes to a close we begin to look to next
year and what we should  plant and what should we pollinate it with. Every
year the pumpkins get bigger and bigger but are we reaching the max.....or
is the max far in the future? Also, since all of todays giants can be
traced back to a common ancestor,sometimes called the pumpkin eve, are we
breeding AG's into a genetic dead end? Is there enough genetic diversity in
the AG line to sustain it? Or will it take new ,yet similar, genetic
material to keep AG's healthy? Don't get me wrong I think the AG is a
selective breeding masterpiece by Mr. Dill its just I want to see the AG
get bigger and better every year for a long,long time to come.
	 I  have only a basic genetic understanding and I have no idea what
the answers to these questions are yet I find the subject very fascinating.
I seem to remember a very lively discussion about just this question
concerning the Mombert 567.6 and the possible new,yet similar, genetic
material introduced by the Laemmle 609 when it pollinated the Holland 616
and created the 567.5. Now we all can see the tremendous effect the 567.5
had on giant pumpkin growing. Why is this seed so special. Is it hybrid
vigor? Or just a lucky cross? It seems to me that something different has
to be going on with this cross. I think it is because of the infusion of
new,yet similar, genetic material into the mainstream AG line.

	But the Laemmle line is gone forever and other maxima pumpkins out
there don't work either. What about the strains that created the AG. I
remember Michael Cohill talking about these(Mammoth Tours and Goderich
Giant I believe) on this list a year or so back. However the consensus of
opinion was that these strains are extinct. But what if one of these or
something like it still exists out there? Handed down generation to
generation as a family heirloom seed....possible.. but unlikely..... or is
it????

	Last year I set out to find if they still might exist somewhere. I
found very few leads. Most leads led back to more modern pumpkins like Big
Max or prizewinner hybrid. Then this summer I caught a break while browsing
through ebay. I found a listing for a heirloom giant pumpkin. I quickly
wrote to the seller of the seeds.

	He told me that they were a heirloom seed in his family and have
been in  his family for at least 3 generations.All record of their name or
where they came from was lost to time. He said they are very consistent
plants and give him 250-350 pound plants without any care. He just plants
them out as any regular field pumpkin and they produce several 250-350
pound fruits per plant without any special care. He lives in Tennessee and
he says they tolerate the heat.

	He seemed very believable. He didn't make any extraordinary claims
about them and was only selling them for a few bucks. So I was quick to buy
some. The seeds look quite different than AG seeds, thinner and smaller. I
was a little skeptical. Even though it was way to late in the
season(August) I planted a seed. It appears to have a comparable vigor and
size of an AG but still it looks a little different. It doesn't have the
yellow streaks on the vine an AG has yet the immature fruit start out more
yellow than an immature AG would. The fruit also have a longish shape with
most of their weight toward the stem end.Unfortunately it was planted to
late to mature any seeds.

	I have Grown AG's, Big max's, Prizewinner hybrids and I would say
that this is different than all three yet it is most similar to the AG.
What I want to do is cross this with an AG, but I don't want to wait till
two years to see the results. This is where I need a southern hemisphere
volunteer to grow it and cross pollinate it with an AG.

	I would like any comments or input on the group about this
experiment. The fact that they produce very consistent results tells me
that they are very inbred. If you cross two similar varieties that are both
inbred then isn't that a good way to set up a type of hybrid vigor??? Will
this infuse new yet similar genetic material into the AG line??? not sure??
help!! Will it work???? I have no Idea. but i think its worth a try.

anxiously waiting for input,
John









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