Re: Terminology--BS, BSE, shelves, ledges

Neil A Mogensen wrote:

> Michael's series of excellent photos and descriptions of "beard spine" 
> and "beard spine extension" have suggested a better way of describing 
> what we have been calling at various times and various places 
> "shelves" and "ledges."
>  
> I have a suggestion.  I propose we standardize on a single set of 
> terms that really will relate to the genetic makeup we are trying to 
> uncover.  Michael's "beard spine" and "beard spine extension," 
> especially with the photos he has offered, make excellent sense.  I 
> suggest we adopt the BS and BSE (for short-hand) for the SAGE study 
> and Bulletin article still in the percolation stage.
>  

I have had more time to think about it and BSE may be a term  that 
involves 2 traits but to KISS I think it will suffice for the moment.

Attending the convention allowed me access to a number of people so I 
will summarize. Paul Black among others confirmed the BSE indicator 
thinking is correct and the "twining" of flounces and spoons is a 
constant. he also confirmed that SA x SA has no detrimental effects at 
all. I wish I could have talked more with Paul but he was constantly 
confronted about DOLCE.

We arrived at Suttons with 2 bus loads of official convention guests to 
add to the number of shoppers already in the garden. Things were very 
hectic with last minute preparations for the Porterville Iris Festival. 
This is the time when 20,000 visitors more than double the population of 
this little dairy town. I mention this so that the you will understand 
the generosity of Mike Sutton who took me on a twenty minute lope 
through the newest seedlings. ( yes I meant lope). As to BS and BSE 
(after a big smirk) he said he thought every one knew that. He said that 
bad effects from SA x SA crosses was a myth. If anyone doubts the BSE or 
SAxSA factors Mike says he has the record books to prove it. The twining 
or mirroring of the flounces and spoons is another thing he thought 
everyone knew. During the 20 minutes we also looked at the small 
quantity of BARBARAS LACE that survived,( it really is worth waiting 
for!!!) median and TB BC SA's (some rebloom) the glowing SA and Bright 
seedlings of the posted photos, a reblooming ROMANTIC EVENING clone, a 
double flounced pink and a lot of others that I can't possible remember. 
We did not have time to see the "flatties" under development with some 
reblooming and some SA's nor did I get to see Mikes 72" 8way branching 
rebloomer.

Whew! Michael M. more on the temperature and daylight hour effects 
tomorrow..

> I have noted what he describes as far back as the fifties and never 
> have heard or seen it described before.  Being a nosy and inveterately 
> curious person, I've poked, prodded and felt just about every feature 
> in TB irises there are.  The sailing ship sail that shows on ADVANCE 
> GUARD shows on a lot of other oldtimers also.  I've seen that many 
> times.  Likewise the "felt" elevated ridge of a BS (beard spine) is 
> something I've seen or felt for many years.  It just never occured to 
> me to explore further what it meant. Thanks to Lloyd Austin's work, 
> persistance and advertising skills we have the SA's today.  The 
> potential has been around for a very long time and may even have some 
> specific species origins. (Talk about redundant language!)
>  
> Thanks to Michael's curiousity, time and attention which he has 
> applied to this problem we have both photos and terms that actually 
> get at the underlying issues we are trying to discuss.  I would find 
> it very helpful if we settled on these terms as our standard, and set 
> aside "shelved, shelf and ledge" as history and go foreward with the 
> more descriptive terms of "Beard Spine" and "Beard Spine 
> Extension"--and get in the habit of abbreviating them to BS, BSE in 
> our internal communications.  In order not to alienate newcomers and 
> cut off outsiders from SAGE we are going to have to use the longer 
> form a while so that those that are just learning terms like "amoena, 
> variegata" and the like aren't even more bewildered than we were when 
> we first got started.
>  
> Is everyone okay with this?  "BEARD SPINE" and "BEARD SPINE EXTENSION" 
> as our standard language. 
>  
> I'd rather not do this by fiat.  How about some feedback--do others 
> find this as useful as I do?
>  
> Neil Mogensen  for SAGE
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *Y*




 
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