THANK YOU EDUARDO!
I'm done with the subject since it appears unlikely we will
soon figure out what all the rest of the plants in this discussion may actually
be. But I thank you all for your input! I, for one, have received
quite an education from all of this!
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, February 26, 2007 1:16
Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] 'Santa
I am sorry for the loooooong
silence, even when my name appear in many
postings on this topic. I have
been somewhat busy lately...
Santa Leopoldina is a city in
Espirito Santo state (Southeastern Brazil)
where the material was supposed
to be collected long time ago. For a weird
reason, it seens that plants
from that area are proned to have long leaves.
(Remember P. stenolobum was
also collected nearby). Since than, people have
outstanding long leaf P. "Santa Leopoldina', but since you
species around with long leaves, the name started to be disputed.
Philodendron spiritus-sancti was collected originally in Domingos Martins
county (that is the just at the southwestern corner of Santa Leopoldina
county). George Bunting never mentioned the name Santa Leopoldina when
describing P. spiritus-sancti, but both names were associated further by
.......... . When I redescribed wild specimens of P.
reinforced that the only Philodendron "Santa
Leopoldina" formally described
was this one. To me (as a taxonomist), only
formally published names are
real names. It is true that other
morpho-species (to be named P. superbum as
fast as we can obtain
wild-collected material of this) has been also
associated with the toponym
Santa Leopoldina, maybe before any other
material. However, Graf's books
are great for the horticulturist, but they
are very far from being formal
in a taxonomic point of view. Since taxonomy
is the only official
scientific way to deal with the plant diversity, Graf's
nomenclature is completely useless. I won't resist to cite that
Amazonian Philodendron billietae and P. atabapoense, and even the
P. curvilobum have been named P. "Santa Leopoldina" too. This is
side of life...A new law simply appeared: since most philos from
Leopoldina have long leaves so every plant with long leaf should be
Santa Leopoldina!!! Pretty smart! (LOL)
My final word? Learn with your
experiences and use one of the mottos:
1. Discussing popular names is
funny, but worthless. If you want something
that comes closer to
unanbiguous nomenclature, ask you friend taxonomist to
make a type
specimen and describe your new plant formally.
2. If you think
Horticultural names should be free from "official" taxonomy,
horticultural rules and register your cultivar.
3. If you don't like
official rules (horticultural or taxonomic), call your
plants as you want,
but don't bother to discuss it.
4. If you are a plant collector and
like to have names in your plants, keep
geographical information with
them. All the pain could be avoided if plants
of the "old" P. Santa
Leopoldina had a geographical label on it. Right now,
we are not 100% sure
that the old P. Santa Leopoldina came in fact from
Philodendron spiritus-sancti is the closer choice!!!!
Dr. Eduardo G. Goncalves
Universidade Catolica de
Curso de Ciencias Biologicas
Sala M-206, QS 7, Lote 1,
CEP 72030-170, Taguatinga – DF,
>From: "Julius Boos" <firstname.lastname@example.org>
of aroids <email@example.com>
Re: [Aroid-l] 'Santa Leopoldina'-last comment
>Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007
>>From : Bluesea <firstname.lastname@example.org>
Discussion of aroids <email@example.com>
: Saturday, February 24, 2007 5:50 PM
>To : Discussion of aroids <firstname.lastname@example.org>
: Re: [Aroid-l] Philodendron 'Santa Leopoldina'
put, well said, Russ, ESPECIALLY paragraph two! I am in total
>agreement, but wish the 'Santa Leopoldina' could just be diminished or
>dropped, as has little or no 'legitimacy' since the publication
>But I BET this does not put and end to
the 'debate'!! :--)
on the photos I've seen of P. spiritus-sancti ('Santa Leopoldina')
>>>and all the other philodendrons erroneously called 'Santa
>>>there can be no mistaking the real thing based on
the strikingly narrow
>>>leaf blade length to width ratio.
To my mind the only philodendron that
>>>can legitimately be
called 'Santa Leopoldina' is the one the Brazilian
endeared with this name for perhaps centuries. And that
>>>plant is P. spiritus-sancti.
>There is no
argument whatever to be made regarding 'first publishing
the name 'Santa Leopoldina' since it is not a scientific name
the control of botanical nomenclature.
>In any case, those who
have labeled these various species and hybrids with
>the name are in
error, including Graf. The name 'Santa Leopoldina' comes
>originally from the Brazilian people of the P. spiritus-sancti
>they coined it for this particular plant, so it cannot be
placed on any
>other philodendron. I do understand there are a
couple of forms of
>spiritus-sancti with minor physical differences,
such as reddish reverse.
>But almost without exception, the
philodendrons being erroneously called
>'Santa Leopoldina' have little
physical similarity to the real
>spiritus-sancti, and can be dismissed
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