Re: Supervolute vernation. Finally a photo!

Dear Marek & Steve: 

 

 

            I am looking at these images and wondering if there is any difference at all in those terms (which has always been my understanding, ie. That they are two terms that meant the same thing. I believe if you  inverted the images they would be the same. All leaves are developed from the apical meristem and so far as I know there is a continuous series of leaves being produced and the younger ones are always coming out inside the other leaves. Can someone better explain how these two differ?

 

Tom

 

From: aroid-l-bounces@gizmoworks.com [mailto:aroid-l-bounces@gizmoworks.com] On Behalf Of Marek Argent
Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 6:26 PM
To: Discussion of aroids; Steve Lucas
Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Supervolute vernation. Finally a photo!

 

Dear Steve,

 

So, I suppose that the term "supervolute" refers to the vernation of a solitary leaf

and "convolute" is the same but in reference to a sequence of leaves

or a spadix within a spathe.

 

I modified a little the drawing sent by you by placing the next leaf and we have the same.

 

In my library I found a document on Monstera obliqua and there is a photo

of convolute vernation of leaves (page 5).

 

Marek

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: S*@exoticrainforest.com

To: aroid-l@gizmoworks.com ; a*@wp.pl

Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2010 5:17 PM

Subject: [Aroid-l] Supervolute vernation. Finally a photo!

 

I screwed up big time and inserted the wrong drawing. 

These are the correct drawings from Stern's showing the placement of the midrib.  It appears the only difference in supervolute and convolute is a leaf forming around another leaf but frankly I still don't have a completely satisfactory explanation.  I try almost daily on my website to make subjects like this clearer for anyone interested in aroids that does not have or is not interested in earning a degree in botany.   I am now to the point of completely removing the subject since I am no longer sure I fully understand it or can help anyone else to understand. 

I don't believe any definition in print in any of the 5 botanical dictionaries I now own make the distinction (if any) between convolute and supervolute clear.  At least in the dictionaries they appear to be synonymous and are one and the same.

Steve
www.ExoticRainforest.com


Marek Argent wrote:

Steve,

 

We cannot talk about vernation types not seeing the midrib as it is presented on the second drawing.

It can as well be a half of a leaf rolled involutely.

 

The third drawing (convolute) is what I thought about (but I was afraid to say) -

that the term "convolute" may refer only to at least two objects

like one leaf inside another one or a spadix wrapped by a spathe.

 

Anyway in my cord photos, the third type, although probably not occuring in Araceae

is possible, so it must have a name too.

 

It's becoming complicated...

 

Marek

-

 



These drawings are from William T. Stern's Botanical Latin, 4th edition.

 

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