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Re: Chaos in Monstera names

  • Subject: Re: Chaos in Monstera names
  • From: brian lee <lbmkjm@yahoo.com>
  • Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2008 12:42:43 -0700 (PDT)

Dear Pete,

Aloha and mahalo for posting these descriptions. It will be very helpful toward straightening out the questions surrounding the so-called dwarf Monstera varieties in cultivation.

Now, are you familiar with any ex-situ collections that have vouchered living plants of both of these species to compare?  From the descriptions, it appears that the so-called Monstera pertusa are all Rhaphidophora tetrasperma...not Rhaphidophora pertusa...at least the ones I have seen.  I am not familiar with the other Rhaphidophora you listed, so I cannot make a judgement as to the similarity, or not, of these species to the dwarf plants in question.  Can any of these be confused with Rhaphidophora tetrasperma in the sterile condition?

Aloha,

Leland


--- On Sat, 6/28/08, Peter Boyce <botanist@malesiana.com> wrote:

> From: Peter Boyce <botanist@malesiana.com>
> Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Chaos in Monstera names
> To: "Discussion of aroids" <aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>
> Date: Saturday, June 28, 2008, 8:22 PM
> Dear Leland,
> 
> Rhaphidophora tetrasperma and R. pertusa are distinct
> species, although they are related. In the same group are
> R. nicolsonii, R. glauca, R. luchunensis and perhaps R.
> corneri.
> 
> I posted a description for R. pertusa yesterday; here is
> the description for R. tetrasperma:
> 
> Rhaphidophora tetrasperma Hook.f., Fl. Brit. India 6 (1893)
> 548; Ridl., Mat. Fl.Malay Penins. 3 (1907) 44--45; Engl.
> & K. Krause in Engl., Pflanzenr. 37 (IV.23B) (1908) 48;
> Ridl., Fl. Malay Penins. 5 (1925) 124 - Type: Malaysia,
> Perak,  Scortechini 169b (K, holo).
>  
> Distribution: Peninsular Malaysia (Kelantan, Perak),
> southern Thailand
>  
> Small to medium-sized, rather slender, semi-pachycaul,
> heterophyllous liane to 5 m; seedling stage a
> non-skototropic shingling juvenile shoot; pre-adult plants
> very rarely forming terrestrial colonies; adult shoot
> architecture comprised of elongated, weakly clinging,
> physiognomically monopodial, flexuous, moderately leafy,
> non-flowering stems and weakly adherent or, more commonly,
> free lateral flowering stems; stems smooth, without
> prophyll, cataphyll and petiolar sheath fibre, internodes
> to 14 x 1 cm, separated by prominent straight leaf scars;
> flagellate foraging stems not observed; clasping roots
> sparsely produced from nodes and internodes; feeding roots
> stout, produced singly or in pairs from most nodes of free
> shoots; leaves weakly spiral-distichous; cataphylls and
> prophylls membranous, soon drying and falling; petiole
> shallowly grooved, 10--34 x 0.2--0.4 cm, smooth, apical and
> basal genicula slightly prominent; petiolar sheath
> prominent, extending to base of apical geniculum, soon
> falling to leave a prominent, slightly corky scar; lamina
> sparsely to + entirely deeply pinnatipartite to nearly
> pinnatisect, occasionally with large rhombic perforations
> adjacent to mid-rib, 12--42 x 9.5--38 cm, broadly ovate to
> ovate-lanceolate, thinly coriaceous, base truncate or very
> weakly cordate, apex acute to acuminate, individual pinnae
> up to 6 cm wide; mid-rib prominently raised abaxially,
> slightly sunken adaxially; primary venation pinnate, raised
> abaxially, slightly impressed adaxially; interprimaries
> diverging from primaries, much less prominent, slightly
> raised abaxially, very slightly impressed adaxially;
> secondary venation weakly reticulate, very slightly raised;
> tertiary venation barely visible; inflorescence few
> together, subtended by two prominent cataphylls, these soon
> falling; peduncle terete, 2--2.5 x 0.3--0.4 cm; spathe
> canoe-shaped, 3--3.5 x 0.8--1.5 cm, stiffly fleshy,
> apparently falling swiftly, white with adherent black
> cataphyll remnants; spadix cylindrical, sessile, inserted
> slightly decurrently on peduncle, 3--3.5 x 0.75 - 1 cm,
> white; stylar region well developed, mostly
> rhombohexagonal, c. 2 x 2 mm, truncate, margins deflexed;
> stigma elliptic, longitudinally orientated, c. 1 x 0.2 mm;
> anthers exserted at anthesis; infructescence not observed.
>  
> Habitat: Disturbed rather dry to moist or wet forest on
> sandstone and granite. 190--760 m altitude.
> 
> 
> Pete
> 
>  
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "brian lee" <lbmkjm@yahoo.com>
> To: "Discussion of aroids"
> <aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>
> Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 9:45 PM
> Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Chaos in Monstera names
> 
> 
> > Dear Tom and the masses,
> > 
> > Aloha.
> > 
> > On an earlier post, I said that Monstera pertusa was a
> valid name...that was based on the Tropicos listing.  On the
> KEW monocot checklist, that name is considered Raphidophora
> pertusa.  Monstera and Rhapidophora are genera that I would
> like to study in greater detail,however, access to vouchered
> and correctly curated living collections are limited.
> > 
> > Pete, are you familiar with Rhaphidophora pertusa? I
> mention this because there is the discussion that many of
> the so-called Monstera pertusa are really Rhaphidophora
> tetrasperma.  Now, I noticed that the diatribution of
> Rhaphidophora tetrasperma and Rhapidophora pertusa are very
> distinct...the former from peninsular Thailand and
> peninsular Malaysia, and R. pertusa from southern
> India,Bangladesh,and Sri Lanka.  Can you comment on this?
> Are they similar species...especially in the sterile state?
>  
> > 
> > Thank you all.
> > 
> > Aloha,
> > 
> > Leland
> > 
> > 
> > --- On Fri, 6/27/08, Tom Croat
> <Thomas.Croat@mobot.org> wrote:
> > 
> >> From: Tom Croat <Thomas.Croat@mobot.org>
> >> Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Chaos in Monstera names
> >> To: "Discussion of aroids"
> <aroid-l@gizmoworks.com>
> >> Date: Friday, June 27, 2008, 10:52 AM
> >> Marek:
> >> 
> >>             Monstera friedrichsthalii is a synonym
> of A.
> >> adansonii but
> >> M. pertusa is not even a Monstera as I recall but
> rather a
> >> Rhapidophora
> >> (Pete is this not correct?). M. karwinskyi is a
> synonym of
> >> M. acuminate,
> >> not the other way around.  M. obliqua has lots of
> synonyms.
> >>  Madison
> >> lists 7 including M. expilata Schott but I intend
> to
> >> resurrect the
> >> latter. 
> >> 
> >>  
> >> 
> >> Tom  
> >> 
> >>  
> >> 
> >> ________________________________
> >> 
> >> From: aroid-l-bounces@gizmoworks.com
> >> [mailto:aroid-l-bounces@gizmoworks.com] On Behalf
> Of Marek
> >> Argent
> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2008 12:13 PM
> >> To: Discussion of aroids
> >> Subject: [Aroid-l] Chaos in Monstera names
> >> 
> >>  
> >> 
> >> Hello,
> >> 
> >>  
> >> 
> >> Can anyone authoritatively tell if:
> >> 
> >>  
> >> 
> >> M. friedrichsthalii = M. adansonii = M. pertusa
> >> 
> >>  
> >> 
> >> M. acuminata = M. karwinskyi
> >> 
> >>  
> >> 
> >> M. obliqua has no synonyms
> >> 
> >>  
> >> 
> >> Best
> >> 
> >>
> Marek_______________________________________________
> >> Aroid-L mailing list
> >> Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com
> >> http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l
> > 
> > 
> >      
> > _______________________________________________
> > Aroid-L mailing list
> > Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com
> > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l
> >_______________________________________________
> Aroid-L mailing list
> Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com
> http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l


      
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