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RE: hybrids

I can't think of any hybrid owner I know who doesn't love their car.  Zem,
there is a great deal of choice out there.  It doesn't hurt to check out all
the options, especially when those options can have a very positive effect
for the environment and for our oil dependency.   

Bonnie (SW OH - zone 5) 

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-gardenchat@hort.net [mailto:owner-gardenchat@hort.net] On Behalf
Of Zemuly Sanders
Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2006 8:58 PM
To: gardenchat@hort.net
Subject: Re: [CHAT] hybrids

My neighbor has a 2004 Prius, and he consistently gets 58 mpg.  It's my
understanding that, around here anyway, the wait is due entirely to demand. 
I've heard Toyota is building new plants to make more.  In the meantime
there is the Toyota Yaris that is not a hybrid but does get around 38 mpg,
and it lists from $10k to about $13k.  There is a wait in getting delivery
on them, too.  I know because I went to the Toyota dealer to look at one. 
I'm not getting a new car for a while, but I'm definitely getting something
with more than the 20 mpg I'm getting now when I do.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kitty" <kmrsy@comcast.net>
To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2006 2:47 PM
Subject: Re: [CHAT] hybrids

> Eva,
> if it cost $6000 more, would you still go for it?
> I'm sure the wait has more to do with the mfgr holding back on 
> production rather than demand being so high, ohterwise they'd increase 
> production to sell more cars.  I think they'd hold back, if indeed 
> they are being subsidized.  They're doing just enough to prove they 
> are actually trying, but not enough to prove they don't need to be
> I think I'd be interested in one down the road after I get my 300,000 
> miles out of my Suzuki, if they come down to a price I could afford.
> Kitty
> neIN, Zone 5
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Eva Tompkins LaBonte" <evatesq@gmail.com>
> To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
> Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2006 3:02 PM
> Subject: Re: [CHAT] hybrids
>> What Bonnie said is 100% right on.  The Prius totally rocks.  It is 
>> THE best car on the market, IMHO.  Like Bonnie, I also bought it to 
>> "walk the walk".
>> I have no problems with power -- the car is pretty "zippy" and I have 
>> no problem taking hills or speeding up real fast to get on the 
>> highway. (The parkways in Long Island have ridiculously short 
>> entrance ramps, so you have to be able to haul _ss to get on the 
>> parkway without getting killed.)
>> I am getting approximately 45-50 mpg right now and I am not stingy 
>> with the AC.  In the winter, the mileage is less, approximately 36-44 
>> mpg.
>> I am at the end of my lease of a 2003.  I have not had one single 
>> mechanical problem with the car.  I have also kept up with the 
>> regular maintenance schedule, which is service every 7500 miles, not 
>> every 3000 miles.
>> I am getting a new Prius for sure.  The new Prius (2004 and later
>> versions)
>> get even better mileage -- they say 55-60 mpg, and they are really 
>> cool and gadety, with Bluetooth technology for wireless cell phone 
>> use, and a push button start, etc.  If you get the navigation system 
>> (which I will), you get a back up camera that comes on when you put 
>> the car in reverse so you can see what's behind you while you're 
>> backing up.
>> I don't know why they say the cars wouldn't sell.  The demand, here, 
>> is such that you nearly always have to wait to get a Prius.  Very 
>> few, if any, are ever available to buy and drive off the lot.  I 
>> ordered the new Prius and expect to have to wait two months before it 
>> comes in.  I see alot of Priuses on the road too.
>> My two cents.  I laugh at the fools filling up their Hummers at the 
>> gas station.
>> Eva
>> On 7/30/06, Bonnie & Bill Morgan <wmorgan972@ameritech.net> wrote:
>>> We need to hear from Eva on this too.
>>> I have had my Prius since 2000.  We too bought it to walk the walk.  
>>> (We were also among the first to try a rotary engine as well when 
>>> they came out as a cleaner burning engine.)  Even though the engine 
>>> is smaller and the electric motor is not terribly large, when you 
>>> couple the two up for a burst of speed or sustained speed, you don't 
>>> get any lag.  You just GO as fast and as quick as any other car on 
>>> the road.  They do NOT lack power.  Anyone who has ever given one a 
>>> proper test can tell you they will get up and go if you kick the gas 
>>> pedal.  Just like every other gas powered vehicle, your mileage will 
>>> go down.  I get 40-50mpg right now in mixed driving.  Now that isn't 
>>> as good as what was initially advertised when we bought the car, but 
>>> it is still a good deal better than anyone else we know is getting 
>>> for their $3.00 per gallon.  If I go highway all the way and fairly 
>>> level road conditions, I get better mileage.  If I do in-town 
>>> driving, low speeds, I also get higher mpg.  Although it pulls hills 
>>> (as when we went through the mountains) without any trouble, it 
>>> costs mileage to do so (though not as much as a conventionally 
>>> powered car.)  It all depends on where the testing is done as to 
>>> whether you get the same mileage.  We've had a number of 
>>> conventionally powered cars that didn't get the mileage they were 
>>> purported to get.
>>> Part
>>> of that is due to topography, part to climate and part to driving 
>>> style.  It is no different with a hybrid.
>>> As for the market for them, nobody driving the luxury vehicles can 
>>> really complain about the pricing.  It is more difficult for lower 
>>> income folks to get into one for certain, but the market IS there or 
>>> there wouldn't be so many hybrids on back order.  My Prius is 
>>> guaranteed 100,000 miles on the power train and many competitive gas 
>>> powered vehicles don't do that.
>>> And
>>> I
>>> know a lot of conventionally powered vehicles that haven't made it 
>>> to 100,000 miles, period.  The story is still out on how long you 
>>> can keep one running.  We are just nearing 80,000.00 but we are not 
>>> seeing any problems other than the occasional burned out light bulb.
>>> If there were any way DH and I could afford another hybrid today, we 
>>> would purchase it in a heart beat!  It is quiet.  It is CLEAN/GREEN 
>>> with emissions so low, the locals don't even test for them anymore 
>>> on a Prius.  (Our first time through, they took forever trying to 
>>> get something to register on their meters and they kept trying to 
>>> re-start it when the gasoline engine shut down and it was just 
>>> running on the electric motor.) I imagine we'll be looking for 
>>> something to replace DH's car when I can find work again.
>>> There are Prius and other hybrid web-sites.  You might want to go 
>>> read some of the comments from other consumers.  I think you would 
>>> be pleasantly
>>> surprised.   Besides, the hybrid industry is relatively new.  I look for
>>> magnitudes of improvements to make them even more efficient in the 
>>> future.
>>> Just in the few years we've had our hybrid, great strides have been 
>>> made in mileage and other features.
>>> I'd like to know what kinds of vehicles the authors of the research 
>>> and the author of the editorial drive.  For many people, it seems, a 
>>> car is something very personal and tied to their 
>>> status/personalities.
>>> Blessings,
>>> Bonnie (SW OH - zone 5)
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: owner-gardenchat@hort.net [mailto:owner-gardenchat@hort.net] 
>>> On Behalf Of Kitty
>>> Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2006 10:00 AM
>>> To: gardenchat@hort.net
>>> Subject: [CHAT] hybrids
>>> Interesting editorial in today's paper.  The author cited research 
>>> done by Reason magazine, National Geographic, CNW Marketing, Weekly 
>>> Standard magazine.  NG I've heard of but I know little about the 
>>> other 3, so I wonder if you hybrid drivers might refute or agree 
>>> with the various parts of it.
>>> "...the market doesn't support them.  They may be PC, but hybrids 
>>> would get nowhere w/o govt and mfg subsidies.  Car companies take 
>>> losses on the cars.
>>> Hybrids cost about $6000 more to make than similar gas-powered cars 
>>> and consumers won't shell that out - whatever their politics - and 
>>> so buyers require the subsidies"...  "..hybrids lack power..."  
>>> "They don't get near the great gas mileage we're told they do"... 
>>> "after a 2yr study on 'dust to dust' energy costs of the cars - 
>>> meaning the energy to plan, build, sell, drive, and dispose of - the 
>>> hybrids don't stack up well against gas-powered counterparts...don't 
>>> last as long - around 100,000 miles vs 300,000 for traditional 
>>> powered vehicles"
>>> Kitty
>>> neIN, Zone 5
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