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Re: How ya gonna keep 'em down on the nursery?

Dear Group,
Yes, as a lurker on this list I have something to say now. I sit as the Chairman of the Industry Advisory Board to the Horticultural School here in Niagara. The College system here is funded by its results in getting a student who starts the program to graduate and become employed upon graduation. They are not concerned about how much they earn or if they stay in the industry. Therefore just keep your numbers up and keep churning them out. When I went to school here the student teacher contact time was 27 to 29 hours a week It is now set at 18 to 19 per week. While organizing a horticultural training program to get the unemployed back to work I would lose potential student like the single mum who could not work in a industry that paid her $ 10.00 / hour. The government says that a student graduating from College should start at $12 to $14 / hr. This is a well kept secret from the students as it is neither in the best interest of the Colleges and the industry to tell them.The Colleges ignore the situation and when it is expressed it is shuffled off. The landscape industry is the only area of the industry that pays well because it relates closely to the labourer rates of numerous trades. I have taught at the college level and none of my students ever got anything but the best from me and my thirty plus years experience in the industry. Most of which was in Garden Center Management. As long as we promote ourselves as gardeners and not professional horticulturists and demand a respectable pay then the general public our audiences will not respect them or us. Money talks just ask how much an electrician or a plumber will charge you. How many times do I go to parties and get asked whats wrong with my plant. Try doing that with a doctor. " Doctor, I have this pain". See what they say and charge . The same goes for how much we charge our clients. At a recent industry seminar the speaker said you have "A" clients; "B' clients; "C" clients and "D" clients. You never do work for the "D " client They are not going to pay you enough and will always want more for nothing . The "C" client is necessary only to keep your staff employed they are not desirable The " B" client is necessary to stay in business but the "A" client pays and on time with out any question or delay. Pick your clients and your employers carefully. Sorry for the rant. I wonder how much trouble the the response will get me in as everything we write is seachable forever on Google.
Bruce Zimmerman
610 CKTB
www.brucezimmerman.com
abz1@canada.com



I just have to jump in with what may seem off-topic: teaching young farmers. I've spent years of my life doing just that and am currently writing a manual for on-farm mentors of "young" farmers, so am in touch with a fair number of people and programs who are educating the next generation..

I have a couple of observations: As a group, organic farmers have seen enormous changes in the demographics of farm apprentices in the last decade. Thirty to 20 years ago, there were so many applicants that farmers could pick and choose their trainees. But the numbers started to thin about 10 years ago, until now, there is intense competition for good applicants. And, as someone else mentioned, a good many of these people are career-changers, people who have become dissatisfied with what they are doing and who have bought a farm and want to grow something--produce, livestock, or a niche crop such as mohair or goat cheese--for their livelihood.
In the past, few apprentices had relevant degrees because so few schools taught much besides what we call "conventional" ag (meaning farm systems that depended on synthetic inputs), if they taught any sort of practical ag. Today, more colleges and universities are teaching practical agriculture and many more are teaching from an organic, or at least a "sustainable" approach. This means that the people who are coming to farmers during or after their university years have a better grounding than they once did.

A second major change has occurred in what apprentices want to learn. They were once focused almost entirely on technique--how to build soils, manage pests, do post-harvest handling, and so on. But today, while they want that sort of practical, hands-on education, they are equally interested in learning about the business side of running a farm. It's as if some hundredth monkey of an ag student suddenly passed on the understanding that producing a quality product is only half the battle--selling it at a profit and running your farm efficiently are where the true challenges lie.

Again, this makes them much more gratifying to teeach.

So even though the ranks have thinned, the remaining apprentices seem a much more realistic, well-grounded group than they once were. As for encouragement: the best impetus for interest in farming is the continuing growth of farmers' markets, CSA farms, and organic aisles at the super market. Small farmers are beginning to make living wages. They aren't getting rich, but the decision to become a farmer is no longer a simultaneous decision to live a life of poverty.

Miranda Smith
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For GWL website and Wiki, go to
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