Re: Polyploid Sum and Substance?

Paul,

I am glad that we can discuss something other than politics (not that I have
not turned CNN on myself).

You are correct about not knowing whether the Hosta chimeras are polyploid
chimeras or not, without testing them (note my caveat in the previous post).
However, the sport of Christmas Tree was induced with herbicides as have
many other polyploids in both Hosta and Daylilies.  Odds are that such
polyploids would be chimeric as only one cell layer would be altered by the
chemical.  Ben has evidence of chimeric polyploids in Hosta using flow
cytometry, a technique that should indicate ploidy level.  Interaction
between two cell layers would probably compensate for differences in growth
rates and remember the slower growing layer is the center of the leaf
leading to a larger edge as expected.

Actually TC does not appear to induce these 'polyploids' with any
regularity.  I have made an active effort to find these sports and have only
found two in all our years of growing TC plants (the third one we induced
post TC).  I just potted up about 20,000 Guacamole a few weeks ago, and can
not find a single sport of any kind in the whole lot (only a few greens and
yellows as off types as expected).

TC does produce sports related to growth rates and these can be very hard to
recognize until the plants are grown on.  I find that dwarfs 'reverting' to
larger plants most common (may just be able to spot these better), but have
found TC plants that refuse to grow fast as well.  Growth rate in many
plants has been shown to be controlled by specific genes (often called
dwarfing genes) and by biochemical disorders.  An example of the latter is
H. Collector's Choice which grows normally in TC (as big and fast as S&S),
but is an extreme dwarf in natural light.  The problem is probably an
inability to photosynthesis under high light conditions.

Jim Anderson
Winterberry Farms TC

----- Original Message -----
From: <Meum71@aol.com>
To: <hosta-open@mallorn.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2000 6:41 PM
Subject: Re: Polyploid Sum and Substance?


> In a message dated 11/14/2000 9:13:48 AM Central Standard Time,
> JmaHosta@WinterberryFarms.com writes:
>
> << These observations point to a chimeric polyploid where the dark
>  green cell layer (center of leaf) is probably polyploid and the light
green
>  cell layer (the edge of the leaf) is not. >>
>
>
> The only way to confirm polyploidy is by looking at the chromosomes,
certain
> growth characteristics may indicate possible polyploid, but it's like says
> "There are clouds in the sky-it's going to rain today" sometimes it's true
> but many times it is not.
>
> Chimeric ploidy plants is an interesting concept-do you know if there is
any
> documentation, I have no evidence to back up my objection, but I would
think
> that diffrent rates of growth between the cell layers would be large
enough
> to cause the cell lines to fail to join together.
>
> Is the increase in substance a result of cuticle thickening or is the
entire
> leaf thicker?
>
> Paul
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