Re: Re: Iris pallida cultivars and nomenclatural question

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Dave & Neil;

 

As you probably both know working with the 1939 checklist is a challenge to say the least. The term squalens in Latin means squalid, dirty, neglected. Although it was used primarily for blends it is hard to be sure that is the exact definition in the mind of the 39 checklist creators. The other problem was; what was designated as pallida in the 39 checklist was not always pure pallida as evidenced by the bracts often being only partially dry at anthesis. Certainly if you have better proof I am always willing to amend the SIGNA checklist but some of the reasons for not including certain names was because  other references made them suspect. Unfortunately my time travel machine does not always work adequately to facilitate a firm diagnosis and what may be extant today can not always be counted on to be what it claims to be. Some more timid souls would have just proclaimed the effort impossible, but we fools tend to try to just muddle through with what we have.

            On the issue of pallida/variegata ancestries, I am certain I had seen squalens proclaimed as a legitimate botanical x name. In other words Iris xsqualens for any variegate/pallida hybrid. But at the moment I can not site a reference. When I feel more energetic I could check Index Kewensis and tell you the author and their original diagnosis and maybe that would shed some light. But for now I have too much to do and the summer lazys have control.

Bob

Neil Mogensen <neilm@charter.net> wrote:

--- In iris-species@yahoogroups.com, dferguson@c... wrote:
"..nomenclatural question...." [concerning *Iris pallida* forms, etc.]

Dave, first of all, let me make a disclaimer. I am by no means an
authority on nomenclature, but I have grown (and loved) several cv's
on your list.

"Squalens" as a term applies to blends and was actively in use in the
AIS registry through 1949; in fact, I suspect the translation from
the Latin would be "blend." I doubt it would be appropriate to apply
the term to all *pallida* x *variegata* hybrids.

Of those you list, I would say these are definitely *not* pallidas--

'La Neige' is a small white of flower form, plant character and
branching that is almost pure *Iris variegata* except for petal
texture and the gloss of the foliage which show its hybrid origin.
It is listed, incidentally, by Winterberry. What I had under that
name was one of the iris I have enjoyed as much as any. It has
elegant simplicity.

'No-we-ta' (the hyphens belong in the name) is a blend, more
*variegata* than *pallida* in character and proportions. It appears
to be quite an advanced generation hybrid with flower form and size
substantially different from either of the parent species.

'Pink Ruffles' is a seedling of 'No-we-ta' and has an almost
identical plant proportion and flower size. As the pollen parent was
close to *pallida* species type except in color--a lovely rose pink--
'Pink Ruffles' does have the *pallida* gloss and color in its
foliage, but like 'No-we-ta' is more *variegata* than *pallida* in my
estimation. It also looks emphatically like a very advanced
generation hybrid. In fact, I'd hazard an opinion that as diploids
go, 'Pink Ruffles' went about as far toward "modern" character as any
diploid. It also is rather late--about 1940.

I think I did grow 'Dogrose' briefly, and likewise 'Eros.' Both look
to be almost pure *pallida* in plant character if I recall rightly,
but I do not believe the pink or rose-pink color of each is typical
of the species. Someone having familiarity with wild populations of
presumably pure *pallida* clones could speak to that with some
authority. I cannot.

Your project is interesting. I should think the historians among us
would find your end results of considerable value.

Neil Mogensen zone 7 western NC mountains






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