RE: INDIANA STATE RECORD

My thoughts exactly Mark, thank you for putting it out that way.  

The 'judges' decision has been final since the weigh-off, the ones making
decisions now were NOT the judges at the weigh-off. Anyway, there must be a
statute of limitations...the money has already been awarded and everyone
went home.

I have challenged rules in the past, but always with the caveat that the
rules are set for this year, they need to be looked at for next year.  

Does the IPGA as a governing body have the right to NOT recognize the
OFFICIAL state record?...absolutely.  

Is it something that can be decided by just the board of directors?...break
out the bylaws, I have no idea.  

Does it look bad since they did this to a fruit that was ruled official at
one of THEIR weigh-offs by one of THEIR members? ...absolutely. 

There are basically four guys who have made this decision, NOT the entire
IPGA and NOT the judges from the weigh-off.  These four have strugggled with
this decision, I know.  They have allowed it to stand as the weigh-off
champion, admitted that it may be a State record, but still say they will
not officially recognize it.

Hey, I like the four of you a lot, and don't wish to make enemies of any of
you, but this is what many of us see.

My apologies to everyone for carrying on.  I am done now.  Bash me in
Private if you wish.

-Gus

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark
To: pumpkins@hort.net
Sent: 9/26/02 5:13 PM
Subject: RE: INDIANA STATE RECORD

I think the original decision should stand, consider it a screw-up by
the
judges or sponsoring body. If nothing was wrong, nothing was leaking,
and it
was declared official, would the judges or governing body pay attention
to
it being loaded back onto the truck or trailer? And if it fell off while
being put back onto said vehicle hours later, would the decision be
reversed
if it broke open & leaked pumpkin juice or internal rot was detected?

I think Tom should get the cash, the prize, the state record. Maybe it
can
have an asterisk next to it that it leaked after being declared legal.

Another way to look at it is: (please no laughs) If I had a Beagle that
had
a Beagle puppy, and the puppy grew the size of a cow (impossible) &
died, if
I weighed the dead GIANT Beagle (was puppy) & it weighed 252.8 lbs 1
minute
after death, did my dog not have a 252.8 lb puppy? Did it not exist if
it
was born? Wouldn't it be the largest Beagle on RECORD? (I told you not
to
laugh.) So, as of today, if someone asked who grew the largest pumpkin
EVER
ON RECORD in Indiana, it's Tom Beachy. If someone asked who holds the
Indiana State Record, it's Tom Beachy. Please note that my far-fetched
example applies only to "existence" and records--competitions &
competitors
will disagree with its theory stating it must be sound, weighed at a
certain
location, weighed on a certain day, etc.

Face the facts: A 1097.5lb pumpkin grown by Tom Beachy DID EXIST, the
largest ever grown ON RECORD in Indiana. Did Tom Beachy break the rules?
NO!
Did somebody screw up? Yes. This weigh-off turned out to be a monumental
day, not only because of the weight, nor because somebody seriously
dropped
the ball (pumpkin?) but also because rules interpretation from that date
on
will forever be altered, rewritten or at least scrutinized to either
better
the "SPORT" or cover somebody's... you know what. Just my 3 cents, I'm
sure
someone will disagree with me.

Mark


-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pumpkins@hort.net [o*@hort.net]On Behalf
Of Greg Sanchez
Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 1:37 PM
To: pumpkins@hort.net
Subject: Re: INDIANA STATE RECORD


All of this comparing rules is getting a little absurd.  The way
football is
officiated shouldn't be the way pumpkins are judged.  If the pumpkin was
bad
according to the rules before it was weighed, it should not be official.
So
what if the judges said it was ok at the time.  In football, if a play
goes
off before a judge can review the play, the play stands.  That is all
nice
and good for them, but why subject weight offs to the same bad logic and
rules.  We have all seen the sports highlights where a ref screwed a
call.
Everyone knows it, including the refs.  This call blows the game and the
"wrong" team wins.  Lets not let this injustice happen in the world of
pumpkins.  We are better than that.  Lets look at the facts and the
rules
and make a proper decision, regardless of how long it takes.  If the
pumpkin
was not sound before it was weighed, then it is unofficial, regardless
of
what the judges said.  Who wants to win if it is a farce anyway.


----Original Message Follows----
From: Brad2julie@aol.com
Reply-To: pumpkins@hort.net
To: pumpkins@hort.net
Subject: Re: INDIANA STATE RECORD
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 18:45:29 EDT

Craig,
            I think you hit the nail on the head.  The IPGA in this case
is
more like the Big Ten is to football.  The judges (officials) made there
ruling on the field.  That ruling still stands by the way.  There are
times
when the overseer of the event need to take a stand in an effort to
maintain
fairness to all involved.  We have tried to do that.  Although I know
some
still do not feel that way.  Maybe we will verify our decision with the
NCAA
(GPC) to be sure we are in compliance.

Brad




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