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Re: infor

Lots of folks here use beneficial nematodes--parts of Florida have serious unbeneficial nematode infestations or problems. I believe Peaceful Valley Farm Supply sells them.

Figs--one of Ms. Fatma's favorite fruits--are especially susceptible. We finally found a Mission fig, genetically engineered by Louisiana State University to be nematode resistant, that has begun to produce large crops of rather smallish figs. Good flavor, but half the size of a regular Mission.

But, this is only its third year of production. And it's not been pruned yet--a task for the next cold season. I plan to severely whack it back this winter and mulch it heavily with rotted cow manure for the dormant season.

On Saturday, June 19, 2004, at 07:29 PM, Kitty wrote:

Yes I tried beneficial nemetodes many years ago. I think it helped,
couldn't say for sure. But my lot is 60 ft wide, bounded by 4 neighbors.
They won't treat heirs and the beetles would just fly on over here.

In my early years of gardening, early-mid 90s, I tried all sorts of stuff,
much of it organic from Gardens Alive!, but also some chemicals and
fungicides suggested by Pirone when I took my courses on pest control. In
the long run, I tried all sorts of stuff, but it gets expensive and not
altogether necessary. Heck, I can live with a little powdery mildew.


----- Original Message -----
From: <gardenqueen@academicplanet.com>
To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
Sent: Saturday, June 19, 2004 4:42 PM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: [CHAT] infor

&#65279;<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<META content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META content="MSHTML 5.00.2614.3500" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>I see. Just curious. Actually have you ever tried the beneficial
nematodes? They take care of all lawn grubs, including Jap beetles which
had not
made it here. We have other kinds though and it gets those too. It also
fire ants, iris borers and flea larvae. Good stuff. Pam Evans Kemp, TX
zone 8A
----- Original Message ----- From: Kitty Sent: 6/19/2004 3:13:00 PM To:
gardenchat@hort.net Subject: Re: Re: [CHAT] infor &gt; Pam, &gt; You must
realize you are an exception. Most people will not spend 16 hours &gt; a
watering their plants. Many people will not live with plants with &gt;
holes in
the leaves if there is a way to prevent it, organic or not. When I &gt;
said not
feasible, I meant not feasible for the general population; I wasn't &gt;
referring to myself. I'm content to live with some destruction, others
won't or can't. Right now I've got a bug here I found on one of my lilies
last year. There was just one last year. I posted pictures, also showed to
our Hort Ed. While trying to get an ID, it destroyed the plant. This year
&gt; I
found 4 of them on a Deutzia. Snipped the whole stem, bagged it and took
&gt; it
in to CES. He said possibly lacebug, but I'm not so sure. Just found 2
&gt; more
on another lily. This bug will not go away with a shot of water, he &gt;
stronger measures and I'm not about to let him go crazy on my lilies. &gt;
Without an ID, though, it's hard to know what to use. &gt; &gt; Anyway,
back to
straight organic. I don't know if you have Japanese Beetles &gt; there,
nothing organic is going to stop them. You can try Milky Spore, &gt; but
the grubs die off there's nothing for MS to feed on and it goes &gt; away.
if it did persist, they'll just wing it over to your nice plants &gt; from
neighbor's untreated yard. &gt; &gt; I firmly believe in IPM and use even
than that warrants. I'm fairly &gt; close to organic, including my
But most people won't spend $30 &gt; / bag to cover 2000 sq ft of lawn.
my neighbor won't spend $5. &gt; &gt; For the activist, all organic is
For the perectionist it is not &gt; feasible. For the the general
population of
gardeners out there who have a &gt; garden as one of their many pastimes,
enjoy puttering in their garden &gt; occasionally, who maybe just are
that their landscape be &gt; presentable, but have no intention of reading
up on
organic methods, it &gt; isn't going to happen. &gt; &gt; Ortho does too
good a
job marketing their chemicals. People who just want &gt; the problem to go
are quick to grab "Bug-B-Gone" I've not read the &gt; label, but just the
thought that they want every bug to be gone scares me &gt; because I know
must detrimentally affect the good bug population as well. &gt; But not
has the level of interest that many of us share on this &gt; list. So many
people have no more than an hour or 2 a week to deal with &gt; their
and it is not realistic to expect that they will strive for &gt; the
solution. &gt; &gt; Kitty &gt; &gt; ----- Original Message ----- &gt;

 To: <gardenchat@HORT.NET>&gt; Sent: Saturday, June 19, 2004
1:10 PM &gt; Subject: Re: Re: [CHAT] infor &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Not
where darlin'?? I've been all organic since I started the &gt; &gt;
bird/butterfly sanctuary 5-6 years ago and was 80% organic before. It &gt;
works here at least. Joanne across the street does the same. Is it &gt;
different there? &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Pam Evans &gt; &gt; Kemp,
TX &gt;
&gt; zone 8A &gt; &gt; ----- Original Message ----- &gt; &gt; From: Kitty
&gt; Sent: 6/19/2004 9:19:43 AM &gt; &gt; To: gardenchat@hort.net &gt;
Subject: Re: [CHAT] infor &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Ceres, &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; I have used Merit a couple of times with good results to protect my
birch &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; tree from Japanese Beetles. I don't know
how much
bee activity there &gt; would &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; be around birch
Merit had

been suggested by our Hort Ed as

a &gt; safer &gt; &gt;

&gt; &gt; &gt; product than those previously used, but no product of

this sort is &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; completely safe. I

was concerned about the affect to soil organisms in &gt; my &gt; &gt;

&gt; &gt;

&gt; application.

&gt; &gt;

&gt; &gt;

&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;

&gt; &gt;

I've been on amessage

board where,

when the subject of


was raised, &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; folks came out vehemently against
it for


sorts of reasons. But the &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; objections came


people that I would guess to be totally organic &gt; types. &gt; &gt;


&gt; In a better world everything would be organic, but with what

we have &gt; today, &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; it's not feasible.



&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; I no longer use Merit

but this is mainly because I am a lazy gardener &gt; and I

&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; don't resort to insecticides unless absolutely


&gt; Beetles &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; seem to have declined in number


the past few

years, but that is &gt; probably &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; cyclical. In
a couple

more years

I may have to resort to such measures


&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; again. &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;


Kitty &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; ----- Original



&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;

From: <CERSGARDEN@AOL.COM>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;

To: <gardenchat@HORT.NET>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Sent:
Saturday, June 19, 2004 8:38 AM &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Subject: [CHAT]
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
I am a lurker on an iris list. I am sending a message copied from it. &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; What &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; are your thoughts? I
never used this product nor have I &gt; researched &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; the
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; use of. The writer seems to be a very
knowledgeable member of this &gt; list. &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
Ceres &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Generally systemic
insecticides are considered to be reasonably safe &gt; to &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; pollinators since they don't get excessive exposure via the
pollen or
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; nectar, but Merit may be a bit different.
active ingredient &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; (imidacloprid) has two
One, at higher doses, is lethal to &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; insects. &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; At lower doses it can affect behavior without directly
killing the &gt; insect, &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; such as stopping
from feeding. It is the behavioral effects &gt; that &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
are &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; of concern regarding bees since it is
that imidacloprid can &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; disrupt &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; foraging activities.-- in fact some of it's uses were banned in
France &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; because of complaints from beekeepers. Bayer (who
it) deny these &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; claims based on what seems
good research, and there haven't been &gt; many &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
complaints about its impact on bees in the US as far as I know. This &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; all &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; complicated by
fact that bee populations in the US have been &gt; decimated &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; by Varroa mites, and if colonies do decline, it could well be
&gt; that &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; are causing it. So, as usual, the
situation is murky, and it depends &gt; who &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
believe. There are some interesting websites on this if anyone is &gt;
&gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; interested in digging deeper. I have a couple of research
projects at &gt; the &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; moment on this compound
its effects on insects, so the area is of &gt; some &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; interest to me and all of this may be more than you wanted to know!.
Bob &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Hollingworth. &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;
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Island Jim
Southwest Florida
Zone 10
27.0 N, 82.4 W

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