Re: Re: Indiana wants me...

The home of Dan Quayle?  Not in our lifetime!  By the way, did I ever tell
you folks that one of the varieties of Hibiscus that I have is a really
beautiful purple and is named Marilyn Quayle?  It's from a hybridizer in
Florida.  I once asked him how I was supposed to sell M.Q. in Marin County,
home of the hot tubs, wealthy liberals and young men who fight with the
Taliban?  He just laughed.

David Franzman
A Touch of the Tropics
www.atouchofthetropics.net
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Kitty" <kmrsy@comcast.net>
To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2004 11:06 AM
Subject: Re: Re: [CHAT] Politics/Bonnie


> Well, we can hope.  But if the Indiana electoral college votes for
president
> EVER went to the man for whom I voted, it would be a first.
>
> Kitty
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <gardenqueen@academicplanet.com>
> To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2004 12:37 PM
> Subject: Re: Re: [CHAT] Politics/Bonnie
>
>
> > I don't know Kitty. I tell the Bushophiles around here, if your boy
> > doesn't get us the H outta Iraq before November, I think he's toast.
> > People are FED up.
> >
> >
> > Pam Evans
> > Kemp, TX
> > zone 8A
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Kitty
> > Sent: 6/29/2004 9:10:33 AM
> > To: gardenchat@hort.net
> > Subject: Re: [CHAT] Politics/Bonnie
> >
> > > >  NOW THAT IS SCARY!  My God people do your civic duty, study the
> >
> > > > issues and vote.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > What is scary (and extremely upsetting)  to me is knowing that my vote
> this
> >
> > > November will go to Nimrod and Ripoff due to the antiquated electoral
> >
> > > college.  My only satisfaction is looking at the popular vote, which
of
> >
> > > course counted for nothing last time around, but still, I will have
done
> my
> >
> > > civic duty.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Kitty
> >
> > >
> >
> > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> >
> > > From: "David Franzman" <dfranzma@pacbell.net>
> >
> > > To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
> >
> > > Sent: Monday, June 28, 2004 11:19 PM
> >
> > > Subject: Re: [CHAT] Politics/Bonnie
> >
> > >
> >
> > >
> >
> > > > Bonnie, it's disturbing!  Politics is the give and take of ideas not
> >
> > > dogma.
> >
> > > > Certainly my views have shifted after hearing a well presented case
> and as
> >
> > > I
> >
> > > > age my beliefs blend and mellow.  Frankly, it's the extremes that
> irritate
> >
> > > > me on both sides.  Whoever doesn't agree with them are unthinking,
> godless
> >
> > > > and unAmerican.  I hate that!
> >
> > > >
> >
> > > > I believe the media has much to do with that.  Instead of thoughtful
> >
> > > > discussion they have to get into these loud, bashing arguments
calling
> >
> > > each
> >
> > > > other names.  Just part of the dumbing down of America.  "What
should
> we
> >
> > > > watch tonight honey the Worlds Wrestling Federation or the Riley
> Report?"
> >
> > > > Pretty pathetic!
> >
> > > >
> >
> > > > One last thing since I'm on a roll:  If 40% are rock solid on one
side
> or
> >
> > > > the other and only 6% are undecided and with only 50% of those
> elegable to
> >
> > > > vote actually doing so then roughly 26% of the electorate dictate to
> the
> >
> > > > rest of the country the direction we will follow for at least the
next
> >
> > > four
> >
> > > > years.  NOW THAT IS SCARY!  My God people do your civic duty, study
> the
> >
> > > > issues and vote.
> >
> > > >
> >
> > > > David Franzman
> >
> > > > A Touch of the Tropics
> >
> > > > www.atouchofthetropics.net
> >
> > > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> >
> > > > From: "Bonnie Holmes" <holmesbm@usit.net>
> >
> > > > To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
> >
> > > > Sent: Monday, June 28, 2004 8:36 PM
> >
> > > > Subject: Re: [CHAT] Politics
> >
> > > >
> >
> > > >
> >
> > > > > I agree that there seems to be growing intolerance for differing
> ideas
> >
> > > and
> >
> > > > > that seems to be supported by some of the political analysis
groups.
> >
> > > > Seems
> >
> > > > > that around 40% of the voters are stuck on each side with little
> >
> > > movement
> >
> > > > > back and forth no matter what the news or issues.  Both parties
> target
> >
> > > the
> >
> > > > > true 6% undecided...now THAT is scary for a democracy.   (Jesse,
are
> you
> >
> > > > > truly in that 6%?)
> >
> > > > >
> >
> > > > > Husband and I went to see Fahrenheit 911 this afternoon...very
> >
> > > > > interesting...biased but definitely thought provoking.  I had
heard
> >
> > > about
> >
> > > > > some of the Saudi connections on a talk show a month back...no one
> knew
> >
> > > > > what the caller was talking about...there is also a book on this
> issue
> >
> > > in
> >
> > > > > addition to Moore's take.
> >
> > > > >
> >
> > > > > Bonnie Zone 6+ ETN
> >
> > > > >
> >
> > > > >
> >
> > > > >
> >
> > > > >
> >
> > > > > > [Original Message]
> >
> > > > > > From: David Franzman <dfranzma@pacbell.net>
> >
> > > > > > To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
> >
> > > > > > Date: 06/28/2004 1:51:50 PM
> >
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAT] Politics
> >
> > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > Let me add something to this.  Bonnie I agree with you that
> politics
> >
> > > is
> >
> > > > a
> >
> > > > > > difficult subject in a gardening group.  I enjoy it because I
> enjoy
> >
> > > > > politics
> >
> > > > > > and the discussion of ideas.  I don't add too much to it though
> >
> > > because
> >
> > > > I
> >
> > > > > > recognize that there are different ideas out there and not
> everybody
> >
> > > > likes
> >
> > > > > > debates.
> >
> > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > However, none of us had the tag "Re-Elect Nimrod and Ripoff for
> >
> > > > President"
> >
> > > > > > until Liz did which was on her first message she sent to the
> group.
> >
> > > > > Perhaps
> >
> > > > > > what she doesn't like is the fact that many of us don't agree
with
> her
> >
> > > > > > position instead of the content and/or subject.  You see I find
a
> >
> > > > growing
> >
> > > > > > lack of respect for differing views in this country from both
the
> >
> > > right
> >
> > > > > and
> >
> > > > > > left but I'm thoroughly sick of those who profess to be
> conservative
> >
> > > > > calling
> >
> > > > > > all of us in the middle or slightly left of center as lefties,
> >
> > > liberals
> >
> > > > or
> >
> > > > > > commies and unAmerican to boot.
> >
> > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > Liz, if you didn't like politics mixed into the garden soil then
> why
> >
> > > did
> >
> > > > > > your initial message have the Re-elect message at the bottom?
Go
> and
> >
> > > > see
> >
> > > > > > the movie!  Stretch your mind.  Keep an open mind and try and
see
> what
> >
> > > > the
> >
> > > > > > other side sees sometimes.  It may not change your mind but it
> might
> >
> > > > give
> >
> > > > > > you a different perspective.
> >
> > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > David Franzman
> >
> > > > > > A Touch of the Tropics
> >
> > > > > > www.atouchofthetropics.net
> >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> >
> > > > > > From: "Kitty" <kmrsy@comcast.net>
> >
> > > > > > To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
> >
> > > > > > Sent: Friday, June 25, 2004 9:37 PM
> >
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAT] Fahrenheit 911
> >
> > > > > >
> >
> > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > Bonnie, Liz, and All -
> >
> > > > > > > Here is the original posting:
> >
> > > > > > > "I saw this movie today, and all I can say is that it was
> awesome!
> >
> > > > > > Everyone
> >
> > > > > > > should make an effort to see it."
> >
> > > > > > > The responses were short items about ticket prices, distances
to
> >
> > > > > theatres,
> >
> > > > > > > plans to see it, and acquisition news.
> >
> > > > > > > There was no mention of "stupidity" in regard to opposing
views.
> In
> >
> > > > > fact,
> >
> > > > > > > no opposing views were voiced.  I don't see any harm in
someone
> >
> > > > > suggesting
> >
> > > > > > a
> >
> > > > > > > movie to the group.
> >
> > > > > > > In fact, I fully intend to see Two Brothers when it gets to a
> >
> > > theatre
> >
> > > > > > close
> >
> > > > > > > to me.  I hope the dog-lovers out there aren't offended by my
> saying
> >
> > > > so.
> >
> > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > Kitty
> >
> > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> >
> > > > > > > From: "Bonnie & Bill Morgan" <wmorgan972@ameritech.net>
> >
> > > > > > > To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
> >
> > > > > > > Sent: Friday, June 25, 2004 10:42 PM
> >
> > > > > > > Subject: RE: [CHAT] Fahrenheit 911
> >
> > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > Liz, not all of us are left in more than our handedness.  It
> does
> >
> > > > > appear
> >
> > > > > > > > that those with left political leanings are more vocal at
this
> >
> > > point
> >
> > > > > > than
> >
> > > > > > > > those of us in the middle or leaning a little more right
> >
> > > > politically.
> >
> > > > > > I
> >
> > > > > > > am
> >
> > > > > > > > not a fan of political name calling and bashing either,
> regardless
> >
> > > > of
> >
> > > > > > > party.
> >
> > > > > > > > I do think that while there is freedom of speech, courtesy
> would
> >
> > > > > dictate
> >
> > > > > > > > that the political discussions should be done privately
rather
> >
> > > than
> >
> > > > in
> >
> > > > > > our
> >
> > > > > > > > normally friendly little garden chat group.
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > Keeping it in this forum does make those of us with a
> different
> >
> > > > > > viewpoint
> >
> > > > > > > > feel as though we are being told we are "stupid" for seeing
> >
> > > another
> >
> > > > > side
> >
> > > > > > > of
> >
> > > > > > > > things by the tone of recent discussions.  I don't carry on
> about
> >
> > > > > Kerry,
> >
> > > > > > > or
> >
> > > > > > > > Kennedy (only to name a few)  or the things I find so
> distasteful
> >
> > > on
> >
> > > > > the
> >
> > > > > > > > left side, because I consider you all as friends and as
> >
> > > individuals
> >
> > > > > > > capable
> >
> > > > > > > > of having independent ideas and I wouldn't want to make you
> think
> >
> > > I
> >
> > > > > > didn't
> >
> > > > > > > > hold you in high esteem even though I disagree with much of
> what
> >
> > > > I've
> >
> > > > > > > heard
> >
> > > > > > > > politically on this list lately.
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > I do love all of you out there, regardless of your politics,
> but I
> >
> > > > too
> >
> > > > > > am
> >
> > > > > > > > tiring of the one-sided nature of the political discussions
as
> of
> >
> > > > > late.
> >
> > > > > > > > Could we all get back to more "friendly" and less political
> >
> > > topics?
> >
> > > > > > Even
> >
> > > > > > > > topics regarding gardening, the ecology, natural resources
and
> >
> > > bills
> >
> > > > > > > > associated with that would be O.K. if it were couched as
> something
> >
> > > > for
> >
> > > > > > all
> >
> > > > > > > > to consider rather than laying blame and/or pointing fingers
> to
> >
> > > this
> >
> > > > > > > > individual or party as if everything you read or hear in the
> press
> >
> > > > > were
> >
> > > > > > > > fact.  There are two sides to every story.  And while we
> >
> > > > finger-point
> >
> > > > > to
> >
> > > > > > > > some unnamed evil, remember that our society is what WE make
> of it
> >
> > > > and
> >
> > > > > > if
> >
> > > > > > > we
> >
> > > > > > > > wanted only one view, we could relax and let someone become
> >
> > > > dictator.
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > O.K., I'm off my soapbox.
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > Blessings,
> >
> > > > > > > > Bonnie (SW OH - zone 5)
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> >
> > > > > > > > From: owner-gardenchat@hort.net
> [o*@hort.net]
> >
> > > > On
> >
> > > > > > > Behalf
> >
> > > > > > > > Of Elizabeth Gessler
> >
> > > > > > > > Sent: Friday, June 25, 2004 7:43 PM
> >
> > > > > > > > To: gardenchat@hort.net
> >
> > > > > > > > Subject: RE: [CHAT] Farenheit 911
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > Can someone please sned me the instructions to unsubscribe
> from
> >
> > > this
> >
> > > > > > list.
> >
> > > > > > > I
> >
> > > > > > > > wasn't aware that this was a politic list with obvious very
> left
> >
> > > > > > leanings.
> >
> > > > > > > > Liz in PA
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > Re-elect Bush-Cheney in 2004
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> >
> > > > > > > > From: owner-gardenchat@hort.net
> [o*@hort.net]
> >
> > > > On
> >
> > > > > > > Behalf
> >
> > > > > > > > Of Kitty
> >
> > > > > > > > Sent: Friday, June 25, 2004 7:49 PM
> >
> > > > > > > > To: gardenchat@hort.net
> >
> > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [CHAT] Farenheit 911
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > I really would love to see it, almost went to the first
> showing
> >
> > > > today
> >
> > > > > at
> >
> > > > > > > > 11:55.  But I reluctantly decided I couldn't spend the $10
it
> >
> > > would
> >
> > > > > cost
> >
> > > > > > > me
> >
> > > > > > > > on a movie.
> >
> > > > > > > > I was thrilled to read, "When Fahrenheit 9/11 opened in New
> York
> >
> > > on
> >
> > > > > > > > Wednesday, it broke box-office records, beating out even Men
> in
> >
> > > > Black
> >
> > > > > > with
> >
> > > > > > > > wall-to-wall sold-out shows"
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > Kitty
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> >
> > > > > > > > From: <Zemuly@aol.com>
> >
> > > > > > > > To: <gardenchat@hort.net>
> >
> > > > > > > > Sent: Friday, June 25, 2004 6:22 PM
> >
> > > > > > > > Subject: [CHAT] Farenheit 911
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > > I saw this movie today, and all I can say is that it was
> >
> > > awesome!
> >
> > > > > > > > Everyone
> >
> > > > > > > > > should make an effort to see it.
> >
> > > > > > > > > zem
> >
> > > > > > > > >
> >
> > > > > > > > >
> >
> > > >
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