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Re: [GWL]: Rodale Press

Jeff,

Yes, all true--except (equally picky here)--milky spore kills the grubs in
the soil, it doesn't kill them above ground. So it doesn't matter whether
the adults that emerge are after a tree or a rose bush. And yes, when you
use neem, you do have to use a sprayer that can get to the top of the tree
and you do have to spray at dawn. However, beetles that eat sprayed leaves
will die. I forgot about the bees, sorry to say. Incidently, I wasn't
disputing the wisdom of using the other substance; I was just giving the
certified remedy and--I hope--making the point that sometimes a certified
grower has to make what seems like a poor choice and, by inference, that the
narrowness of Rodale did serve a real function.
 And sorry, Lon, if this is OT, but I wanted to reply.

Miranda Smith


----- Original Message -----
From: Jeff Ball <jeffball@starband.net>
To: <Gardenwriters@topica.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2001 2:04 PM
Subject: RE: [GWL]: Rodale Press


> Miranda,
> You are right, we need a forum.  I need to point out however (picky,
picky,
> picky) the issue at hand was a tree being eaten by Japanese beetles.
Milky
> spore does not deal with trees, and Neem has the same problem as the
> pyrethroids or the organophosphates - it needs to be sprayed over the
entire
> tree and contact should be made with the beetle.  Milky spore will only
> control the development of beetles where you use it.  The beetles can
still
> come from the neighbor's yard.  Nematodes will work ONLY if they are
applied
> properly and at the right time; it can be very tricky.
>
> Jeff
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Miranda Smith [m*@tagoresmith.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 11:50 AM
> To: Gardenwriters@topica.com
> Subject: Re: [GWL]: Rodale Press
>
> My perspective on this topic is a little bit different. Personally--that
is,
> as a private person--I believe that some substances currently outlawed by
> Organic Certification Regs are preferable to approved substances. A good
> example is the use of Imidan (outlawed) for plum curculio vs. rotenone
> (approved). Imidan is far less ecologically damaging than rotenone. But
> thanks to the restrictive nature of the national law, growers who want to
be
> certified sometimes have to make poor choices in favor of the letter,
rather
> than the spirit, of the legislation. This is a drag and every organic
farmer
> in the country knows it.
>
> Consequently, I think there is a real need for published information that
> details the "certifiable" way to do things as well as alternatives that
> might or might not be more ecologically sensitive. Jeff is correct--there
is
> no such forum at this time. I don't know how large a readership you could
> find for this kind of information, but I'm guessing that the many readers
of
> OG would be very happy to subscribe to such a publication along about now.
> So if any of you have venture capital looking for a home, you might
consider
> such a publication.
>
> Incidently, there are "certifiable" ways to deal with Japanese beetles. In
> Zones 6 and southward, milky spore really does kill the grubs. In Zone 5,
> milky spore might or might not survive long enough to provide control. In
> Zones 5 through 3, you can count on beneficial nematodes. For the adult
> beetles, you can use Neem. It's effective and certifiable. (The politics
> behind the registration of Neem products are a little dicey though--I
think
> that kind of information also needs open discussion in the mainstream
> press.)
>
> Miranda Smith
>
>
>
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Jeff Ball" <jeffball@starband.net>
> > To: <Gardenwriters@topica.com>
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 4:18 PM
> > Subject: RE: [GWL]: Rodale Press
> >
> >
> > >
>
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